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some questions about isgenug


Olli
14.06.07, 22:00
my tracert stops at 10giga.rbx-1-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.226].

Would you fix it please?

sledge0303
14.06.07, 21:20
Same issue here with Hansenet connections. My pings today are around 100ms.
I am using Xen VE atm for some tests but it shoudn't be the cause for. Earlier it was just an addition for about 10ms per VM and definately not compareable with todays ping time.

Possible download, without any limits in webdaemon settings, max 2MB/sec, yesterday 3+MB/sec
I know, not compareable with problems you have atm but just want to say it isn't only you who experienced some some problems with speed/connection.

May Monsieur Le Directeur starts reading these threads again and may find a way out of this disease

s0cke
14.06.07, 21:02
same here:
1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms ipcop.localdomain [192.168.2.1]
2 * * * Zeitüberschreitung der Anforderung.
3 40 ms 45 ms 40 ms 217.0.68.74
4 46 ms 51 ms 46 ms f-ea5.F.DE.net.DTAG.DE [62.154.16.165]
5 48 ms 47 ms 47 ms 62.156.138.190
6 46 ms 45 ms 51 ms if-6-0-0.core2.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net [80.231.64.2]
7 54 ms 56 ms 54 ms if-11-0-0.core1.PV1-Paris.teleglobe.net [80.231.65.66]
8 56 ms 61 ms 56 ms 195.219.215.2
9 59 ms 55 ms 60 ms 195.219.224.30
10 238 ms 234 ms 232 ms 10giga.th1-1-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.241]
11 224 ms 217 ms 217 ms gsw-1-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.251.130.162]
12 237 ms 238 ms 236 ms 10giga.rbx-1-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.226]
13 235 ms 242 ms 249 ms rbx-6-m1.routers.ovh.net [213.251.191.13]
14 229 ms 232 ms 219 ms *** [87.*.*.*]

Olli
14.06.07, 16:54
Got Big problems right now to get a ping to my server. (isgenug)
The Problem is DEFINITELY ovh!! Watch my Tracert:

1 * * * Zeitüberschreitung der Anforderung. (My Router)
2 44 ms 44 ms 45 ms 217.0.68.138
3 * * 48 ms f-ea5.F.DE.net.DTAG.DE [62.154.16.161]
4 48 ms 47 ms 48 ms 62.156.138.190
5 49 ms 49 ms 48 ms if-1-0-0-711.core2.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net [80.231.64.26]
6 57 ms 57 ms 57 ms if-11-0-0.core1.PV1-Paris.teleglobe.net [80.231.
65.66]
7 58 ms 57 ms 59 ms 195.219.215.2
8 58 ms 57 ms 57 ms 195.219.224.30
9 168 ms 168 ms 161 ms 10giga.th1-1-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.241]
10 154 ms 154 ms 154 ms gsw-2-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.251.130.223]
11 162 ms 161 ms 166 ms 10giga.rbx-2-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.222]
12 * * * Zeitüberschreitung der Anforderung.
13 * * * Zeitüberschreitung der Anforderung.

Think this is clear!
Plz Fix that!

Olli

TF_SChw@rZl!cht
31.05.07, 17:56
Zitat Zitat von Centro
by the way! -- Do you understood what the topic of this thread is?

I dont think so! - So please have a look at page one!

Greetz Centro
I had read the first post !

.....

B2T

Centro
30.05.07, 20:34
Zitat Zitat von TF_SChw@rZl!cht
Can you tell me please why you wrote in english ?

I think oles don't read this conversation ^^ and for all other people is the german version more helpful
by the way! -- Do you understood what the topic of this thread is?

I dont think so! - So please have a look at page one!

Greetz Centro

Centro
30.05.07, 20:32
Excuse me to brake your discusion:

It was better with my ping at the last days!

Just have a look at this:
traceroute to 213.251.170.207 (213.251.170.207), 30 hops max, 40 byte packets
1 fritz.fonwlan.box (192.168.178.1) 0.343 ms 0.285 ms 0.339 ms
2 217.0.116.192 (217.0.116.192) 13.955 ms 14.725 ms 14.650 ms
3 217.0.76.18 (217.0.76.18) 14.208 ms 17.683 ms 13.190 ms
4 f-ea5.F.DE.net.DTAG.DE (62.154.16.165) 23.344 ms 22.470 ms 22.965 ms
5 62.156.138.190 (62.156.138.190) 21.771 ms 21.914 ms 22.656 ms
6 if-1-0-0-711.core2.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net (80.231.64.26) 22.551 ms 22.479 ms 22.777 ms
7 if-11-0-0.core1.PV1-Paris.teleglobe.net (80.231.65.66) 33.094 ms 31.521 ms 31.507 ms
8 195.219.215.2 (195.219.215.2) 32.551 ms 32.565 ms 32.074 ms
9 195.219.224.30 (195.219.224.30) 30.952 ms 31.834 ms 31.542 ms
10 10giga.th1-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.241) 197.601 ms 202.884 ms *
11 p19-25-m1.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.78) 203.246 ms 203.173 ms 204.546 ms
12 ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207) 237.112 ms 239.496 ms 239.390 ms

... ANY QUESTION ABOUT DT? --- Now OVH will have a bigger prob i think!

Ping above 250ms! --- Bad is such other things!

64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=12 ttl=56 time=225 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=13 ttl=56 time=221 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=14 ttl=56 time=222 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=15 ttl=56 time=198 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=16 ttl=56 time=189 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=17 ttl=56 time=231 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=18 ttl=56 time=229 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=19 ttl=56 time=184 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=20 ttl=56 time=203 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=21 ttl=56 time=204 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=22 ttl=56 time=205 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=23 ttl=56 time=234 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=24 ttl=56 time=233 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=25 ttl=56 time=236 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=26 ttl=56 time=199 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=27 ttl=56 time=238 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=28 ttl=56 time=188 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=29 ttl=56 time=194 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=30 ttl=56 time=196 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=31 ttl=56 time=201 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=32 ttl=56 time=249 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=33 ttl=56 time=251 ms
64 bytes from ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207): icmp_seq=34 ttl=56 time=247 ms


Greetz Centro

sledge0303
23.05.07, 19:58
Zitat Zitat von OVH_Kunde
Why don't you change the X-Mailer in the PHP-Code?
It isn't php code, webmail doesn't mean always php. Prob is solved anyway, it needes some changes in source code and recompile groupware again.

TF_SChw@rZl!cht
23.05.07, 19:46
Can you tell me please why you wrote in english ?

I think oles don't read this conversation ^^ and for all other people is the german version more helpful

OVH_Kunde
23.05.07, 19:42
Zitat Zitat von sledge0303
No worries. I have a bigger prob with mail atm, not my mail server, my webmail proggie...
I sent mails by Thunderbird or Outlook either = everything's OK
I sent mails by OX webmailer, they are delayed for a couples of hours till its delivery or get spam filtered by some several public mail providers (hotmail, lycos and fastermail). The only difference in mail header information is the tool what has been used for sending mails. Verryyyy strange

Why don't you change the X-Mailer in the PHP-Code?

sledge0303
23.05.07, 10:21
Zitat Zitat von OVH_Kunde
Hi Sledge,

didn't know that it is just simple!
Thanx
No worries. I have a bigger prob with mail atm, not my mail server, my webmail proggie...
I sent mails by Thunderbird or Outlook either = everything's OK
I sent mails by OX webmailer, they are delayed for a couples of hours till its delivery or get spam filtered by some several public mail providers (hotmail, lycos and fastermail). The only difference in mail header information is the tool what has been used for sending mails. Verryyyy strange

OVH_Kunde
22.05.07, 19:44
Hi Sledge,

didn't know that it is just simple!
Thanx

sledge0303
22.05.07, 10:05
Zitat Zitat von OVH_Kunde
But then i have to run a POP3-Server what i don't want
I know it from 1&1, there your DNS is set to mx.1und1.de and 1&1 forwards the mail xyz@youdomain.com to your homeaddy

isnt that possible at ovh?
Once again. It is possible if your Postfix setup is ok. It have nothing to do with OVH. Just another question to avoid missunderstandings. Are you talking either about
1) hosting package or
2)forwarding from dedicated server to personal mail addy?

For 1, I have no solution yet because it isn't me who owns hosting packages at OVH

For 2, an incomming mail to your dedicated server can be forwarded to an addy of your choice. It just need propper setup for mail server only.
Read point 'aliasing' and 'forwarding' in Postfix manual, I recommend.

Believe me, an ambitious admin like you will solve that lil prob very soon without any pre-chewed solutions

An example, I assume you run Postfix, MySQL and have 2 internal/external e-mail addies.

Mail Addies
1 = name1@your-ovh-domain.de
1a=name1@hotmail.com
2 = name2@your-ovh-domain.de
2a=name2@gmail.com

An incomming mail for 1 arrives at your dedicated server. Postfix recognize in its setup a mail forwarding rule. We call that rule alias.cf.
That rule says, messages for 1 should be forwarded to 1a.
You need to tell Postfix to do this in its config.
The same for 2 who want forwarded his/her mails to 2a.

OVH_Kunde
22.05.07, 09:10
Zitat Zitat von sledge0303
In your Postfix/Exim4 config. RTFM, it is explained very well how to manage this.
But then i have to run a POP3-Server what i don't want
I know it from 1&1, there your DNS is set to mx.1und1.de and 1&1 forwards the mail xyz@youdomain.com to your homeaddy

isnt that possible at ovh?

sledge0303
22.05.07, 07:46
Zitat Zitat von OVH_Kunde
how is that possible?
In your Postfix/Exim4 config. RTFM, it is explained very well how to manage this.

OVH_Kunde
22.05.07, 07:09
Zitat Zitat von paul_panzer
Guess you havnt understood what oles has told you. Create a dns incl. mx-record for mail solution. It takes about 48 hours till every server around the globe takes that DNS.
but a dns isn't an email forwaring

i don't want this postmaster@ account..i just want a forward from webmaster@mydomain.de to my normal email account

how is that possible?

oles@ovh.net
21.05.07, 21:05
We will fix forum this week. To much work today

oles@ovh.net a écrit:
> we fix it on monday.
>
> Fritz a écrit:
>>
>> OVH_Kunde;3395 Wrote:
>>> Du hostest selbst? Von wem hast du die Standleitung angezapft? Wenn Du seine Beiträge gelesen hast, wüsstest Du, mit welchem Carrier er

>> Verträge hat. Das soll doch aber hier nicht Thema sein, oder?
>>
>> OVH, please enable Personal Messages for this Forum, this will reduce
>> some OT Questions and it will be possible to reach some Users without
>> email.
>> thanks in advance Fritz


paul_panzer
21.05.07, 19:51
Zitat Zitat von OVH_Kunde
hi,
what is a "dns account?" you mean the Hosting Packet? This will override my DNS Settings, which will result in an offtime.
Guess you havnt understood what oles has told you. Create a dns incl. mx-record for mail solution. It takes about 48 hours till every server around the globe takes that DNS.

OVH_Kunde
21.05.07, 18:52
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
OVH_Kunde a écrit:
> what makes me very sad, that there is NO email-addy included with the
> domains. I have to take this silly webhosting package with overrides me
> my DNS settings.
>
> Isn't there a way to get a simple email addy included with the domain?
> This doesnt has to be a POP3 Account, a simple forwarder would be
> enough!


you can create a dns account with domains & emails redirection
with no limit with the domains that you have in ovh or not, for
free.
hi,
what is a "dns account?" you mean the Hosting Packet? This will override my DNS Settings, which will result in an offtime.

oles@ovh.net
21.05.07, 09:04
OVH_Kunde a écrit:
> what makes me very sad, that there is NO email-addy included with the
> domains. I have to take this silly webhosting package with overrides me
> my DNS settings.
>
> Isn't there a way to get a simple email addy included with the domain?
> This doesnt has to be a POP3 Account, a simple forwarder would be
> enough!


you can create a dns account with domains & emails redirection
with no limit with the domains that you have in ovh or not, for
free.



OVH_Kunde
21.05.07, 08:55
Dear Octave,

what makes me very sad, that there is NO email-addy included with the domains. I have to take this silly webhosting package with overrides me my DNS settings.

Isn't there a way to get a simple email addy included with the domain?
This doesnt has to be a POP3 Account, a simple forwarder would be enough!

sledge0303
20.05.07, 11:41
Dear Octave,

We really appreciate an enabled PM function as well, thanks.

@Fritz

Du hast Post

oles@ovh.net
20.05.07, 10:48
we fix it on monday.

Fritz a écrit:
>
> OVH_Kunde;3395 Wrote:
>> Du hostest selbst? Von wem hast du die Standleitung angezapft? Wenn Du seine Beiträge gelesen hast, wüsstest Du, mit welchem Carrier er

> Verträge hat. Das soll doch aber hier nicht Thema sein, oder?
>
> OVH, please enable Personal Messages for this Forum, this will reduce
> some OT Questions and it will be possible to reach some Users without
> email.
> thanks in advance Fritz


Fritz
20.05.07, 06:39
Zitat Zitat von OVH_Kunde
Du hostest selbst? Von wem hast du die Standleitung angezapft?
Wenn Du seine Beiträge gelesen hast, wüsstest Du, mit welchem Carrier er Verträge hat. Das soll doch aber hier nicht Thema sein, oder?

OVH, please enable Personal Messages for this Forum, this will reduce some OT Questions and it will be possible to reach some Users without email.
thanks in advance Fritz

OVH_Kunde
20.05.07, 04:03
Zitat Zitat von sledge0303
Sledgelein hostet selbst und weiss wovon er redet
Es sind keine OVH spezifischen Probleme, die haben inzwischen fast alle Provider die auf Backbones der Telekom angewiesen sind.
Es kommt auch drauf an was du unter einem 'Super-Ping' verstehst...
Du hostest selbst? Von wem hast du die Standleitung angezapft?

sledge0303
19.05.07, 23:22
Ich zitiere mich nochmal selbst zum Abschluss von diesem Thema:

Um etwas zu ändern müsste die OVH und manch anderer ISP neue Möglichkeiten anbieten - die sehr teuer sind.
PS: Im Keller würd ich mit dem RZ Probleme bekommen

OK, back to topic.

Centro
19.05.07, 22:53
Zitat Zitat von sledge0303
Es kommt auch drauf an was du unter einem 'Super-Ping' verstehst...
Auch wenn das manche Herren nicht hören möchten. Dennisda hat absolut recht! - Ich hab zwar kein RZ im Keller aber ich denke kein Mensch hat sowas was mit OVH gerade abgeht schon mal gesehen! -- Ich bin nun schon ne ganze Weile Besitzer von Rootie und sowas hab ich noch nie erlebt!
Ich höre die ganze Zeit P2P! - Also hierzu kann ich nur sagen: Es gibt mittlerweile viel schnellere und effizientere Tauschbörsen als Emule etc. die mal richtig kräftig Traffic ballern. So 400GB per month is nix für einen USER DSL!!!!
Die Edonkeyzeiten sind meiner Meinung nach vorbei und auch wenn unsere DSL Leitungen immer dicker werden kann ich mir nicht im geringsten Vorstellen das es nur an P2P im Allgemeinen scheitert. --- wieso habe ich wenn immer das margentafarbene T schuld ist eine konstante DL Rate von 1,7-1,9 MB/s bei DSL 16000 von 1und1 (T-Online) ? - Weil mein Server in Frankfurt nicht über die T geht? - 1. Tut er das wohl und zweitens gleich zweimal! --- Also kanns das nicht sein. - Es sind einzelne Punkte, in denen von mir aus sogar die Teledoof was zu machen hat, die extrem überlastet sind. Diese zu umgehen oder zu entlasten dürfte nicht das Problem sein!?

Mal angenommen alles ist so wie ihr es sagt: Was um alles auf der Welt bringt den kompletten Transfer zwischen Bayern und Paris mit über 100ms Unterschied zwischen 10 Uhr Morgens und 10 Uhr Abends zum erliegen? - SICHERLICH KEIN P2P!!!

Also nun bitte mal allgemein zurück zu den Fakten: Hier gehts um ein Thema das ich momentan nur von OVH kenne!
INFO: Zum Thema Ports sperren oder drosseln! -- Bei S4Y is auch alles offen und die haben die Themen nicht da sie a) besser drauf schauen und b) Die ihre Verbindungen wohl überdenken!

Kleiner Gedankenanstoß um hier ein paar mal von ner Sackgasse raus zu holen!

So weit ich hab momentan 22:52 Uhr einen Ping von
PING 213.251.170.207 (213.251.170.207) 56(84) bytes of data.
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=1 ttl=56 time=84.8 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=2 ttl=56 time=73.5 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=3 ttl=56 time=39.4 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=4 ttl=56 time=82.5 ms

traceroute to 213.251.170.207 (213.251.170.207), 30 hops max, 40 byte packets
1 fritz.fonwlan.box (192.168.178.1) 0.378 ms 0.265 ms 0.329 ms
2 217.0.116.192 (217.0.116.192) 15.056 ms 15.405 ms 14.576 ms
3 217.0.76.26 (217.0.76.26) 13.361 ms 12.724 ms 13.184 ms
4 f-ea5.F.DE.net.DTAG.DE (62.154.16.165) 22.171 ms 22.788 ms 22.639 ms
5 62.156.138.190 (62.156.138.190) 22.355 ms 21.643 ms 22.421 ms
6 * if-6-0-0.core2.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net (80.231.64.2) 123.665 ms 123.892 ms
7 if-11-0-0.core1.PV1-Paris.teleglobe.net (80.231.65.66) 131.981 ms 132.147 ms 131.928 ms
8 195.219.215.2 (195.219.215.2) 132.946 ms 132.378 ms 132.829 ms
9 195.219.224.30 (195.219.224.30) 131.877 ms 131.909 ms 131.805 ms
10 10giga.th1-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.241) 39.443 ms 40.087 ms *
11 p19-25-m1.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.78) 40.506 ms 41.350 ms 40.714 ms
12 ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207) 47.117 ms 46.537 ms 43.987 ms

Greetz Centro

sledge0303
19.05.07, 16:37
Zitat Zitat von dennisda
sledge0303'lein wenn das so ist warum habe ich in DE selbst einen super Ping und auch in anderen EU staaten ? und nicht zu FRance ?
Sledgelein hostet selbst und weiss wovon er redet
Es sind keine OVH spezifischen Probleme, die haben inzwischen fast alle Provider die auf Backbones der Telekom angewiesen sind.
Es kommt auch drauf an was du unter einem 'Super-Ping' verstehst...

dennisda
19.05.07, 12:55
sledge0303'lein wenn das so ist warum habe ich in DE selbst einen super Ping und auch in anderen EU staaten ? und nicht zu FRance ?

sledge0303
19.05.07, 12:45
Hallo,

ihr dürft bei der ganzen Sache nicht vergessen: das Internet ist total geflutet mit DSL Kunden die p2p FS und andere Sachen betreiben. Diese tugendenden belasten die Backbones zu jeder Tages und Nachtzeit, aus dem Grund der Monitor wird während des herunterladens ausgeschaltet und Filme etc ohne Ende gezogen.
Würde das Unternehmen endlich anfangen, die eigenen AGBs strikt umsetzen, d.h. FS unterbinden - es wird nur geduldet - oder die Ports entsprechend drosseln - wird es eher schlechter als besser.
OVH kann nur bestimmte Routen nehmen, evtl. wäre es über Neuseeland nicht so voll, dafür mit jedem weiteren Hop langsamer.
Um etwas zu ändern müsste die OVH und manch anderer ISP neue Möglichkeiten anbieten - die sehr teuer sind.

Auch wenn das niemand gerne wahr haben möchte, es ist so!

Centro
19.05.07, 10:55
Zitat Zitat von s0cke
Ja, Änderungen sind möglich und sind auch schon geschehen
Speed ist besser geworden, aber noch nicht perfekt (abends noch etwas langsamer). Aber wenigstens kümmert man sich jetzt um die Probleme.
Freut mich das es bei dir so ist!- Bei mir ist der Ping jetzt gerade um 10:55 mit 36ms recht in Ordnung... nur abends um 23 Uhr, wo eigentlich auch nichtmehr die Welt los ist da hatte ich erst gestern 132ms schon wieder!!!!

Ich hoffe das die OVH das echt bald in den Griff bekommt, für produktivsysteme ist das keine Grundlage!

s0cke
19.05.07, 10:24
Zitat Zitat von dennisda
Nu stellt sich meine Frage ob änderungen in zukunft geschehn bzw möglich sind ?!
Ja, Änderungen sind möglich und sind auch schon geschehen
Speed ist besser geworden, aber noch nicht perfekt (abends noch etwas langsamer). Aber wenigstens kümmert man sich jetzt um die Probleme.

Enn
19.05.07, 10:00
Zitat Zitat von dennisda
oles__at__ovh.net (wer ist das eigentlich ?)
http://forum.ovh.de/showpost.php?p=3272&postcount=17

dennisda
19.05.07, 09:26
Hi,

etwas englisch kann ich ja lesen und sehe an den auschnitten von den Pings und Tracert das Ihr mit oles@ovh.net (wer ist das eigentlich ?) über den Speed diskutiert. Nu stellt sich meine Frage ob änderungen in zukunft geschehn bzw möglich sind ?!

oles@ovh.net
19.05.07, 00:04
thanks !

bene a écrit:
>
> Oles, the URL of DTAG looking Glass is:
> https://f-lga1.f.de.net.dtag.de/index.php
>
>


Centro
18.05.07, 22:02
At the moment the connection is very bad!!!

I hoped the prob was in the past but i have to see that was just a dream!!!!

PING 213.251.170.207 (213.251.170.207) 56(84) bytes of data.
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=1 ttl=56 time=128 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=2 ttl=56 time=134 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=3 ttl=56 time=134 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=4 ttl=56 time=133 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=5 ttl=56 time=109 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=6 ttl=56 time=132 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=7 ttl=56 time=121 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=8 ttl=56 time=125 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=9 ttl=56 time=124 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=10 ttl=56 time=122 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=11 ttl=56 time=136 ms

--- 213.251.170.207 ping statistics ---
11 packets transmitted, 11 received, 0% packet loss, time 9999ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 109.557/127.595/136.153/7.540 ms

Oh Oh, i dont know why my connection ist very good in the morning and very bad in the evening!

Olli
18.05.07, 18:33
mhm this is the traceroute with the DTag link :

Code:
traceroute to 91.121.xx.xxx (91.121.xx.xxx), 15 hops max, 40 byte packets
 1  F-EA20.F.DE.net.DTAG.DE (194.25.0.217)  0.343 ms   0.253 ms   0.404 ms
 2  f-eb1.F.DE.net.DTAG.DE (62.154.18.46)  0.502 ms   0.936 ms   0.577 ms
 3  f-ea5.F.DE.net.DTAG.DE (62.154.16.161)  0.804 ms   0.804 ms   0.830 ms
 4  62.156.138.190  0.809 ms   0.811 ms   0.830 ms
 5  if-6-0.core2.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net (80.231.64.2)  185.585 ms   184.721 ms   173.897 ms
 6  if-5-0-0.core1.PV1-Paris.teleglobe.net (80.231.65.66)  10.721 ms   10.501 ms   10.594 ms
 7  195.219.215.2  10.586 ms   10.592 ms   10.716 ms
 8  195.219.224.30  10.592 ms   10.588 ms   10.691 ms
 9  10giga.th1-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.241)  129.905 ms * *
10  gsw-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.251.130.162)  130.355 ms   130.719 ms   130.833 ms
11  10giga.rbx-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.226)  92.006 ms *   92.031 ms
12  213.251.191.40  136.418 ms   137.405 ms   137.146 ms
13  91.121.xx.xxx  94.918 ms   95.046 ms   93.784 ms

PING :

Code:
PING 91.121.xx.xxx (91.121.xx.xxx) 56(84) bytes of data.
64 bytes from 91.121.xx.xxx: icmp_seq=1 ttl=58 time=104 ms
64 bytes from 91.121.xx.xxx: icmp_seq=2 ttl=58 time=115 ms
64 bytes from 91.121.xx.xxx: icmp_seq=3 ttl=58 time=146 ms
64 bytes from 91.121.xx.xxx: icmp_seq=4 ttl=58 time=134 ms
64 bytes from 91.121.xx.xxx: icmp_seq=5 ttl=58 time=137 ms
64 bytes from 91.121.xx.xxx: icmp_seq=6 ttl=58 time=132 ms
64 bytes from 91.121.xx.xxx: icmp_seq=7 ttl=58 time=112 ms
64 bytes from 91.121.xx.xxx: icmp_seq=8 ttl=58 time=122 ms
64 bytes from 91.121.xx.xxx: icmp_seq=9 ttl=58 time=104 ms
64 bytes from 91.121.xx.xxx: icmp_seq=10 ttl=58 time=127 ms

--- 91.121.xx.xxx ping statistics ---
10 packets transmitted, 10 received, 0% packet loss, time 9094ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 104.541/123.752/146.822/13.523 ms
Location is Frankfurt

bene
18.05.07, 18:19
Oles, the URL of DTAG looking Glass is: https://f-lga1.f.de.net.dtag.de/index.php

Olli
18.05.07, 18:13
Didn't understood if that is a yes or no. Anyway, here's my tracert. I didn't change my IP since this morning.

Current IP Address: 84.160.xxx.xx

Me -> Server :
Code:
  1     *        *        *     Zeitüberschreitung der Anforderung. (My Router)
  2    48 ms    47 ms    47 ms  217.0.68.134
  3    60 ms    50 ms    50 ms  f-ea5.F.DE.net.DTAG.DE [62.154.16.161]
  4   153 ms   152 ms   150 ms  62.156.138.190
  5   152 ms   151 ms   151 ms  if-6-0.core2.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net [80.231.64.2]
  6   161 ms   160 ms   160 ms  if-5-0-0.core1.PV1-Paris.teleglobe.net [80.231.65.66]
  7   163 ms   161 ms   161 ms  195.219.215.2
  8   161 ms   160 ms   162 ms  195.219.224.30
  9   169 ms   165 ms     *    10giga.th1-1-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.241]
 10   164 ms   169 ms   169 ms  gsw-2-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.95]
 11   170 ms   166 ms   165 ms  10giga.rbx-2-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.222]
 12   163 ms   161 ms   162 ms  213.251.191.168
 13   178 ms   193 ms   172 ms  [91.121.xx.xxx]
Server -> Me :
Code:
 1:  ksxxxxxx.kimsufi.com (91.121.xx.xxx)                   0.360ms pmtu 1500
 1:  91.121.31.253 (91.121.31.253)                          0.811ms 
 2:  rbx-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.251.191.1)               0.676ms 
 3:  213.186.32.225 (213.186.32.225)                        4.334ms 
 4:  no reply
 5:  dtag-1.ar2.LON3.gblx.net (64.215.195.174)            asymm  7  97.112ms 
 6:  s-eb1.S.DE.net.DTAG.DE (62.154.22.42)                asymm 13 146.818ms 
 7:  217.0.68.137 (217.0.68.137)                          asymm 13 148.556ms 
 8:  no reply
 9:  217.0.116.63 (217.0.116.63)                          asymm 13 116.168ms pmtu 1492
10:  no reply
11:  no reply Continous...
Hope this helps.

mfg Olli

oles@ovh.net
18.05.07, 13:54
> Does it help if i post traceroutes?

I need a looking glass of DT (forgot the link ).
Then I will try to play with community to see if
there a better way to reach ovh from DT.


Olli
18.05.07, 13:04
13h.

Ping:
Minimum = 88ms, Maximum = 122ms, Mittelwert = 103ms

DL: ~300 kb/s (700 possible)

Much better than yesterday.

Does it help if i post traceroutes?

s0cke
18.05.07, 12:21
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
s0cke a écrit:
>


thanks for information. Let's use Global Crossing to reach DT in place of
Teleglobe.

Please send me a feedback about this issue.
Hello oles,
thank you very much, pings and download speeds are much better now

Pings are jumping around between 60 and 130ms, but the average is about 95ms. Since I'm not playing online games on my server these pings are ok for me.
My download speed is around 310 kb/s (of 365kb/s possible) but it's also jumping around a lot.
I'll tell you if anything changes during the next days or during other times of day.

Thanks again for changing the routing!

s0cke

Olli
18.05.07, 11:03
Hello,

I post my traceroute to help you finding a solution for this irritating problem with T-Online.

I'm using DLS 6000K by T-Online.
Current DL from Server: about ~390 kb/s (2320 kbps)


Me -> Server :

Code:
  1     *        *        *     Zeitüberschreitung der Anforderung. (My Router)
  2    47 ms    47 ms    47 ms  217.0.68.134
  3    59 ms    50 ms    50 ms  f-ea5.F.DE.net.DTAG.DE [62.154.16.161]
  4    77 ms    79 ms    78 ms  62.156.138.190
  5   123 ms   202 ms   211 ms  if-6-0.core2.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net [80.231.64.2]
  6    88 ms    85 ms    86 ms  if-5-0-0.core1.PV1-Paris.teleglobe.net [80.231.65.66]
  7   101 ms    87 ms    89 ms  195.219.215.2
  8    89 ms    87 ms    86 ms  195.219.224.30
  9    71 ms    73 ms    75 ms  10giga.th1-1-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.241]
 10   145 ms   198 ms   203 ms  gsw-2-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.95]
 11    77 ms    78 ms    83 ms  10giga.rbx-2-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.222]
 12    77 ms    75 ms    72 ms  213.251.191.168
 13    74 ms    70 ms    70 ms  [91.121.xx.xxx]
Server -> Me :
Much NoReply's?
Code:
tracepath 84.160.xxx.xx
 1:  ksxxxxxx.kimsufi.com (91.121.xx.xx)                   0.314ms pmtu 1492
 1:  91.121.31.253 (91.121.31.253)                          0.838ms
 2:  rbx-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.251.191.1)               0.655ms
 3:  213.186.32.225 (213.186.32.225)                        4.349ms
 4:  no reply
 5:  dtag-1.ar2.LON3.gblx.net (64.215.195.174)            asymm  7  12.428ms
 6:  s-eb1.S.DE.net.DTAG.DE (62.154.22.42)                asymm 13  26.702ms
 7:  217.0.68.137 (217.0.68.137)                          asymm 13  28.587ms
 8:  no reply
 9:  no reply
10:  no reply
11:  no reply
12:  no reply
13:  no reply
14:  no reply
15:  no reply
16:  no reply
17:  no reply Continous....
Server -> Hetzner Root :
Code:
tracepath 88.198.xx.xx
 1:  ksxxxxxx.kimsufi.com (91.121.xx.xx)                   0.345ms pmtu 1500
 1:  91.121.31.253 (91.121.31.253)                          0.875ms
 2:  rbx-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.251.191.129)             0.680ms
 3:  213.186.32.225 (213.186.32.225)                        4.313ms
 4:  th2-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.4)                4.699ms
 5:  lambdanet.FreeIX.net (213.228.3.243)                 asymm  6   5.777ms
 6:  FRA-1-pos212.de.lambdanet.net (82.197.144.21)        asymm  7  14.623ms
 7:  FRA-3-pos100.de.lambdanet.net (217.71.96.70)         asymm  6  14.570ms
 8:  NUE-2-pos100.de.lambdanet.net (217.71.96.74)         asymm  7  18.171ms
 9:  lambdanet-gw.hetzner.de (213.239.242.214)            asymm  7  63.632ms
10:  hos-bb2.juniper1.rz6.hetzner.de (213.239.240.143)    asymm  7  18.087ms
11:  et.2.16.rs3k44.rz6.hetzner.de (213.239.229.183)      asymm  7  18.681ms
12:  static.88-198-xx-xx.clients.your-server.de (88.198.xx.xxx) asymm  8  19.216ms reached
     Resume: pmtu 1500 hops 12 back 8

Hetzner Root -> Server :
Code:
traceroute to 91.121.xx.xxx (91.121.xx.xxx), 30 hops max, 52 byte packets
 1  static.88-198-55-33.clients.your-server.de (88.198.55.33)  0.399 ms  0.322 ms  0.319 ms
 2  hos-tr2.juniper1.rz6.hetzner.de (213.239.229.129)  0.671 ms  0.201 ms  0.194 ms
 3  hos-bb1.juniper2.s02.hetzner.de (213.239.240.232)  0.524 ms  0.532 ms  0.635 ms
 4  decix.routers.ovh.net (80.81.192.209)  14.470 ms  14.610 ms  14.530 ms
 5  gsw-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.34)  14.421 ms  14.586 ms  14.819 ms
 6  10giga.rbx-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.226)  17.847 ms  18.212 ms  19.640 ms
 7  213.251.191.40 (213.251.191.40)  18.453 ms  19.605 ms  19.918 ms
 8 91.121.xx.xxx  18.559 ms  18.568 ms  17.945 ms


I Hope this helps in anyway. Yesterday my DL Rate was the whole day at max ~30 k/byte

sledge0303
18.05.07, 09:09
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
sledge0303 a écrit:
> I recommend to do this only. An admin of compromised server should
> store logfiles, start investigations to find security leak and
> reinstall node. That's the only way.


no, it doesn't. we have lot of php's backdoor. and you haven't
reinstall server if it arrives.

I manage lot of cases and I've done it for Ovh for 7 years now.
It works great.

> Hop 6 have a star, I did that trace to several times and realized


normal. I put lot of protection on our routeurs. they don't like
ICMP and answer if they want to. It doesn't mean there is a problem.
It just means the routers don't like that you send to the routeur
this ICMP packet and dropped it.
I see. My solution for this is different a bit like yours but result isn't.
A big thank you to answer my first questions about for me important questions regarding support key, Network and a few more.
I have seen the latest posts about connect probs for DTAG users. It seems DTAG is that crowded what could cause an impossible mission for you to solve this prob. I'm not sure you ever heard from 'Colt'. This is the provider where our servers are connected to internet and we have similar probs like you.
Of course, it isn't a datacenter comparable with yours, just a closed small group of customers/business partners only.
My provider have checked every possible routing and in the evening/beginning of late afternoon, all peoples are using their DSL connects, it becomes that kind of slow...... not that bad like DTAG-->OVH but... grrrr

oles@ovh.net
18.05.07, 08:14
sledge0303 a écrit:
> I recommend to do this only. An admin of compromised server should
> store logfiles, start investigations to find security leak and
> reinstall node. That's the only way.


no, it doesn't. we have lot of php's backdoor. and you haven't
reinstall server if it arrives.

I manage lot of cases and I've done it for Ovh for 7 years now.
It works great.

> Hop 6 have a star, I did that trace to several times and realized


normal. I put lot of protection on our routeurs. they don't like
ICMP and answer if they want to. It doesn't mean there is a problem.
It just means the routers don't like that you send to the routeur
this ICMP packet and dropped it.


sledge0303
18.05.07, 07:02
I reboot the server in the rescue mode.
I recommend to do this only. An admin of compromised server should store logfiles, start investigations to find security leak and reinstall node. That's the only way.

Back to traceroute. Here's mine: Hansenet/Alice to my server:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.0.1

2 18 ms 20 ms 25 ms lo1.br02.ber.de.hansenet.net [213.191.89.2]

3 17 ms 17 ms 17 ms ge-4-0-0-102.cr02.ber.de.hansenet.net [62.109.108.126]

4 35 ms 35 ms 35 ms so-5-0-0-0.cr02.fra.de.hansenet.net [213.191.87.225]

5 35 ms 35 ms 36 ms po2-0.pr02.decix.de.hansenet.net [213.191.87.202]

6 * 45 ms 45 ms decix.routers.ovh.net [80.81.192.209]

7 44 ms 45 ms 45 ms gsw-2-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.251.130.223]

8 48 ms 48 ms 48 ms 10giga.rbx-2-6k.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.222]

9 49 ms 49 ms 48 ms rbx-6-m1.routers.ovh.net [213.251.191.141]

10 49 ms 49 ms 49 ms ks36328.kimsufi.com [87.98.217.121]

Centro
18.05.07, 07:01
Good Morning Sir,

im so happy about my watch onto the trace and the ping!

I will hope you happy with us too!

Have a look at this!!!

TRACE:
traceroute to server-forum.net (213.251.170.207), 30 hops max, 40 byte packets
1 fritz.fonwlan.box (192.168.178.1) 0.328 ms 0.301 ms 0.596 ms
2 217.0.116.192 (217.0.116.192) 13.877 ms 14.869 ms 14.053 ms
3 217.0.76.18 (217.0.76.18) 12.765 ms 12.844 ms 13.159 ms
4 f-ea5.F.DE.net.DTAG.DE (62.154.16.165) 22.551 ms 21.198 ms 21.460 ms
5 62.156.138.190 (62.156.138.190) 21.876 ms 21.910 ms 21.652 ms
6 if-6-0-0.core2.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net (80.231.64.2) 23.454 ms 22.3 90 ms 21.660 ms
7 if-11-0-0.core1.PV1-Paris.teleglobe.net (80.231.65.66) 30.691 ms 31.816 ms 30.508 ms
8 195.219.215.2 (195.219.215.2) 31.168 ms 30.868 ms 30.973 ms
9 195.219.224.30 (195.219.224.30) 30.591 ms 30.231 ms 31.034 ms
10 10giga.th1-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.241) 39.321 ms 39.157 ms 39.286 ms
11 p19-25-m1.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.78) 40.520 ms 39.760 ms 38.918 ms
12 ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207) 38.839 ms 39.279 ms 39.025 ms


PING:
PING 213.251.170.207 (213.251.170.207) 56(84) bytes of data.
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=1 ttl=56 time=38.7 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=2 ttl=56 time=38.6 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=3 ttl=56 time=38.8 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=4 ttl=56 time=39.1 ms

--- 213.251.170.207 ping statistics ---
4 packets transmitted, 4 received, 0% packet loss, time 3002ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 38.607/38.838/39.124/0.276 ms


VERY VERY GOOD! I think this is a big job and i hope it will be allright in the future!

Thanks and best regards

Centro

oles@ovh.net
18.05.07, 05:24
s0cke a écrit:
>


thanks for information. Let's use Global Crossing to reach DT in place of
Teleglobe.

Please send me a feedback about this issue.


Magicxs
18.05.07, 00:47
same probs like s0cke..if i routed by the green way..all works fine..otherwise is it just lame..

oles@ovh.net
17.05.07, 18:12
> That's okay but what do you do in case it isn't activated?

I reboot the server in the rescue mode.

> If you can get access to that node all the time you keep it for
> necessary, is there a backdoor in 'made-at-OVH' Kernel 2.6.18/2.4.X to
> activate that support key? Or is that key activated automatically past
> every installment by LINUX installations-images?


second.


s0cke
17.05.07, 12:02
Hello oles,

I just made two traceroutes to show you were the problem is.
Both IPs are using T-Online (DT).

Code:
traceroute to 84.162.212.134 (84.162.212.134), 30 hops max, 40 byte packets
 1  87.98.218.252 (87.98.218.252)  0.528 ms  0.517 ms  0.386 ms
 2  rbx-2-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.251.191.130)  0.297 ms *  0.313 ms
 3  10giga.gsw-2-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.221)  4.122 ms  3.967 ms *
 4  th1-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.11)  4.383 ms  4.285 ms *
 5  10giga.teleglobe.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.242)  4.556 ms  4.512 ms  4.499 ms
 6  195.219.224.29 (195.219.224.29)  13.928 ms  13.925 ms  13.904 ms
 7  195.219.215.1 (195.219.215.1)  4.919 ms  4.931 ms  4.869 ms
 8  if-2-0.core2.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net (80.231.65.65)  13.847 ms  13.837 ms  13.859 ms
 9  if-5-0.core1.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net (80.231.64.1)  13.793 ms  13.798 ms  13.752 ms
10  62.156.138.189 (62.156.138.189)  115.469 ms  115.453 ms  115.626 ms
11  og-eb1.OG.DE.net.DTAG.DE (62.154.104.66)  119.921 ms og-eb1.OG.DE.net.DTAG.DE (62.154.104.62)  119.957 ms og-eb1.OG.DE.net.DTAG.DE (62.154.104.66)  119.961 ms
12  217.0.68.69 (217.0.68.69)  126.227 ms  121.257 ms  120.889 ms
13  p54a2d486.dip.t-dialin.net (84.162.212.134)  158.992 ms  161.413 ms  160.725 ms
Code:
traceroute to 217.227.180.215 (217.227.180.215), 30 hops max, 40 byte packets
 1  87.98.218.252 (87.98.218.252)  0.513 ms  0.551 ms  0.382 ms
 2  rbx-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.251.191.1)  0.437 ms *  0.308 ms
 3  213.186.32.225 (213.186.32.225)  3.974 ms  3.954 ms *
 4  10giga.global-crossing.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.129)  4.097 ms  4.040 ms  4.024 ms
 5  dtag-1.ar2.LON3.gblx.net (64.215.195.174)  11.758 ms  11.649 ms dtag-2.ar2.lon3.gblx.net (64.208.110.34)  11.622 ms
 6  og-eb1.OG.DE.net.DTAG.DE (62.154.104.66)  26.192 ms  26.074 ms  26.226 ms
 7  217.0.73.241 (217.0.73.241)  26.263 ms  26.147 ms  26.124 ms
 8  pd9e3b4d7.dip.t-dialin.net (217.227.180.215)  61.138 ms  58.734 ms  58.889 ms
As you can see the first one (it's me) uses a different routing and has high pings and slow downloads (50 kb/s atm). Yesterday my routing was perfect and I had pings like 50ms. But I got a new IP address and now it's slow again.
My old one and my current address both start with 84, so thats not the problem.

I hope I got the tracert right and it looks like this:
http://pic.leech.it/thumbs/1erouting.png
The red line is the slow one and the green line is the fast one.
Isn't it possible to route all the DT traffic through the fast one?

I don't know much about routing and other related stuff, so it might all be wrong

s0cke

sledge0303
17.05.07, 10:46
Hello Octave,

All servers that we install in Ovh are our ssh's key. If they have no key
we can't sell it

The question would be: why Ovh don't remove ssh's key when the server is
sold to a customer. The anwser is easy: if a customer tells us "my
server doesn't work," or "I have this bug" we need to connect to the servers
and verify it. We have lot of newbe customer (it's our market) and lot of
system admin with lot of experiance. The newbe customer needs lot of help.
Without the ssh's key we can't help him.

It's full secure, since only 3-4 persones in Ovh (!!) has full access to
the server. The rest of support has a "automatic/diag script access".

If your box is hacked and I have access to the server, I will kill all
hacked process. If I have no access I will reboot your server in rescue
mode.

It's the choose of the customer to remove or let access for Ovh.

In general why:
- 99% of french's customer let our ssh's key
- 50% of german's customer let our ssh's key
- 15% of polish's customer let our ssh's key
- 90% of spain's customers let our ssh's key

I think it is question of:
- history/culture of each market
- the part of newbe customers
- what you are doing with the server (www, email or p2p, mp3, divx)

I think at the moment, we only start in german. The statistics will be
better in the futur
Many thanks for this statement. It left a question, may you can answer here or in a private statement.
Angy wrote, you install that support key with every new installment without its activation, what means peoples need to activate it first before you can use it for login to that node.
You say, you take hands on it in case of that node got compromised. That's okay but what do you do in case it isn't activated yet?
If you can get access to that node all the time you keep it for necessary, is there a backdoor in 'made-at-OVH' Kernel 2.6.18/2.4.X to activate that support key? Or is that key activated automatically past every installment by OVH images?

Centro
17.05.07, 09:43
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
Centro a écrit:
> 5 62.156.138.190 (62.156.138.190) 21.093 ms 21.248 ms 21.748 ms
> 6 if-6-0.core2.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net (80.231.64.2) 123.102 ms
> 123.125 ms 124.292 ms


okey. it's DT problem.
Oh my god, exactly this is the problem of OVH! - Thanks for this answer!

Procedur:
I have connection problems only to the OVH network. So i decide to contact the OVH Support! - Allright done! - Next day your supporter answered to me with a please to get him files of Trace Ping and a bigger file to load! - About this i got a next answere where i read for my words: Hey man, thats the prob of DT not of us, so why are you angry about this. Its normal that the connection to a User in good old germany from paris is very bad in periods.

I dont know how you will find a solution for this!

Checklist i think is this:

First time this what you try to do here! --> So, very good, and Thanks!
Next, collect the points of interest and have a look to realize it. --> Connection over DT wasnt so bad why now!!?
After this you can think to offer servers in Germany.

The Servermarket in Germany is full of bad but in good offers too so i think you will be on the black list of powerusers in the future!

So for remember my points of interest:
I thinked about extend the server at december this year.

a) find a solution for the DT connection and dont say "Ph, thats your prob, im not at DT DSL! --
b) If you will find a solution for this so put a small but honestly anwere to us where we can see that you have realy interest to make a good job!

Thank you at this time for a fast solution !

Greetz Centro

oles@ovh.net
17.05.07, 07:14
> The Kimsufi with 20eur without taxes could maybe do around 500 gb/month
> so it would be a win-win situation....


hmm ... it sounds not bad. I don't know yet what much Gb/mo we will
propose since I will try to connect 1x10Gbps of DT in Paris. They
takes the time to answer ...

Anyway I think we will work with Level3 too soon. But the problem
of DT is a general problem: all connection of DT with the rest of
world are full. The only solution I see is to buy paid peering with
DT in Paris, and hope DT is not full inside of their network ...


oles@ovh.net
17.05.07, 07:10
> Oles, can you tell me how much OVH has to pay for 1GB german traffic?

the transit costs are 100Mbps = 1000Euro/mo


oles@ovh.net
17.05.07, 07:06
> there has been a 'diskussion' about the OVH 'support-key' in this and
> other forums (Webhostlist etc.) about data security. May be it's not
> legal to install the key per default without informing the customers? I
> tried to explain some people, who are afraid to be controlled by
> OVH-access at their servers, that this key is only for Support. Such
> a key is not welcome to the 'Powerusers', may be only for unexperienced
> admins needing more help from the support?! But I think, a statement
> or proofing of concept from OVH is needed too ;-)


All servers that we install in Ovh are our ssh's key. If they have no key
we can't sell it

The question would be: why Ovh don't remove ssh's key when the server is
sold to a customer. The anwser is easy: if a customer tells us "my
server doesn't work," or "I have this bug" we need to connect to the servers
and verify it. We have lot of newbe customer (it's our market) and lot of
system admin with lot of experiance. The newbe customer needs lot of help.
Without the ssh's key we can't help him.

It's full secure, since only 3-4 persones in Ovh (!!) has full access to
the server. The rest of support has a "automatic/diag script access".

If your box is hacked and I have access to the server, I will kill all
hacked process. If I have no access I will reboot your server in rescue
mode.

It's the choose of the customer to remove or let access for Ovh.

In general why:
- 99% of french's customer let our ssh's key
- 50% of german's customer let our ssh's key
- 15% of polish's customer let our ssh's key
- 90% of spain's customers let our ssh's key

I think it is question of:
- history/culture of each market
- the part of newbe customers
- what you are doing with the server (www, email or p2p, mp3, divx)

I think at the moment, we only start in german. The statistics will be
better in the futur

Octave


oles@ovh.net
17.05.07, 06:54
Centro a écrit:
> 5 62.156.138.190 (62.156.138.190) 21.093 ms 21.248 ms 21.748 ms
> 6 if-6-0.core2.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net (80.231.64.2) 123.102 ms
> 123.125 ms 124.292 ms


okey. it's DT problem.


Fritz
17.05.07, 06:44
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
.... please
resend all of them on forum. I will try to answer.
Hi Octave,
there has been a 'discussion' about the OVH 'support-key' in this and other forums (Webhostlist etc.) about data security. May be it's not legal to install the key per default without informing the customers? I tried to explain some people, who are afraid to be controlled by OVH-access at their servers, that this key is only for Support. Such a key is not welcome to the 'Powerusers', may be only for unexperienced admins needing more help from the support?! But I think, a statement or proofing of concept from OVH is needed too ;-)

with kind regards
Fritz

sledge0303
17.05.07, 01:42
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
> *The point was 'no' reply* - nothing else

Okey. You didn't receive any answer from Ovh about this technical
question. Sorry for that.

I think I did it now. If I didn't answer all your questions, please
resend all of them on forum. I will try to answer.

Octave
Hi,

no worries, I really understand and honour your intentions to do something better what has been missed in the past. It seems everything could go back in track again, that's what count.
Anyway you answered a few questions I have had in mind in your latest statements.
I really hope your german crew will be part of this again.
There are much more questions and suggestions for future in my minds, a few belong to public and rest for personal conversation by mail. I'll sort out these before I start.

Thomas

oli
17.05.07, 00:58
On 2007-05-16, OVH_Kunde wrote:
>
> Oles, can you tell me how much OVH has to pay for 1GB german traffic?
>
>


test

bene
16.05.07, 22:34
Centro: I really can understand your problmes with T-Online and their resellers.
I used my Server @OVH for hosting and got a lot of complaints about the bad connection.
But I can't understand the big T... They are damn uncooperative if you have trouble with their connection - mostly you get the answer: "buy traffic and it will work"
The really strange thing is: from T-Business Connections there are no Speed Problems - so it seems they are shaping international traffic... But why? I don't know it.
(funny thing besides: their own dedicated servers had also massive bandwith problems in jan/feb

OVH_Kunde: There won't be any concrete numbers - But you can calculate with about 10ct/GB...
But don't forget - Power fees will be around 15€ in FR and the hardware (not only your server, routers, switches and so on too) has to be bought, staff has to be paid and so on.
The Kimsufi with 20eur without taxes could maybe do around 500 gb/month so it would be a win-win situation....

OVH_Kunde
16.05.07, 22:23
Oles, can you tell me how much OVH has to pay for 1GB german traffic?
I think to understand what is a win-win situation it is nescessary to know.

So if you won't do it here, would you do it per mail?

Centro
16.05.07, 22:21
Zitat Zitat von bene
To compare i made also a traceroute via arcor:
You can see that - since there are no problems - it should be somthing wrong in the TeleGlobe routing...

Yes thats right i made a ping from my second Server at Server4you to the "Kimsufi"Server and i even got 10-15ms. The same since the Server started.
Just my connection @Home wont be good to the Server.
You can see older posts in which you read this prob from other persons, but this posts are from december or a bit younger.
My connection to the server was always top, i loaded with 1,8mb/s (DSL 16000) an the ping was between 28-45ms. With this ping i can live.

If you have Teamspeak breaks with the server you will have a bigger prob on it i think!

I think it will only be see with T-Online and 1und1 DSL!

Greetz Centro

bene
16.05.07, 22:12
To compare i made also a traceroute via arcor:

Routenverfolgung zu ks34395.kimsufi.com [213.251.170.207] über maximal 30 Absch
nitte:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms fe-1-0.dsr1.mah.smooth.im [192.168.17.1]
2 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms dslb-088-073-064-001.pools.arcor-ip.net [88.73.64.1]
3 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms bln-145-254-5-161.arcor-ip.net [145.254.5.161]
4 15 ms 15 ms 15 ms ffm-145-254-18-45.arcor-ip.net [145.254.18.45]
5 18 ms 18 ms 18 ms dus-145-254-19-122.arcor-ip.net [145.254.19.122]
6 23 ms 22 ms 23 ms amd-145-254-16-130.arcor-ip.net [145.254.16.130]
7 30 ms 46 ms 29 ms amsix.routers.ovh.net [195.69.145.231]
8 30 ms 30 ms 31 ms p19-25-m1.routers.ovh.net [213.186.32.78]
9 30 ms 30 ms 30 ms ks34395.kimsufi.com [213.251.170.207]

Ablaufverfolgung beendet.
You can see that - since there are no problems - it should be somthing wrong in the TeleGlobe routing...

Centro
16.05.07, 22:06
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
> Since two weeks i got much connection Problems to my sites and to the
> server. More than 130ms ping and no more than 70KB ftp download!!!


can you give more information about "I" ? I need you IP and IP of
your server in Ovh. I will check all this.
I post in your "Routing" Post but here you have the infos too.

Traceroute from me at home with 1und1 to my Server KS34395.kimsufi.com

traceroute to 213.251.170.207 (213.251.170.207), 30 hops max, 40 byte packets
1 fritz.fonwlan.box (192.168.178.1) 0.353 ms 0.247 ms 0.264 ms
2 217.0.116.192 (217.0.116.192) 17.321 ms 16.964 ms 14.514 ms
3 217.0.76.18 (217.0.76.18) 13.227 ms 12.603 ms 13.085 ms
4 f-ea5.F.DE.net.DTAG.DE (62.154.16.165) 21.699 ms 21.714 ms 20.922 ms
5 62.156.138.190 (62.156.138.190) 21.093 ms 21.248 ms 21.748 ms
6 if-6-0.core2.FR1-Frankfurt.teleglobe.net (80.231.64.2) 123.102 ms 123.125 ms 124.292 ms
7 if-5-0-0.core1.PV1-Paris.teleglobe.net (80.231.65.66) 134.018 ms 132.748 ms 132.456 ms
8 195.219.215.2 (195.219.215.2) 134.120 ms 132.800 ms *
9 195.219.224.30 (195.219.224.30) 132.816 ms 133.208 ms 132.518 ms
10 10giga.th1-1-6k.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.241) 132.577 ms * *
11 p19-25-m1.routers.ovh.net (213.186.32.78) 133.588 ms 133.425 ms 133.172 ms
12 ks34395.kimsufi.com (213.251.170.207) 133.054 ms 132.920 ms 132.868 ms

Ping to Server:
PING 213.251.170.207 (213.251.170.207) 56(84) bytes of data.
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=1 ttl=52 time=132 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=2 ttl=52 time=132 ms
64 bytes from 213.251.170.207: icmp_seq=3 ttl=52 time=133 ms

--- 213.251.170.207 ping statistics ---
3 packets transmitted, 3 received, 0% packet loss, time 1999ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 132.600/132.839/133.077/0.194 ms


Greetz Centro

oles@ovh.net
16.05.07, 21:54
> 1&1 shows that real 100mbit flatrates for 69€/month are possible
>
> a friend is hosting linux images on the server and has 10-20TB
> traffic/month and nobody says anything against it


Sorry but I will not answser about the competitors. But I read and
verify all informations about every good idea, something that is
possible elsewhere and not in Ovh. So please continue !


oles@ovh.net
16.05.07, 21:52
> *The point was 'no' reply* - nothing else

Okey. You didn't receive any answer from Ovh about this technical
question. Sorry for that.

I think I did it now. If I didn't answer all your questions, please
resend all of them on forum. I will try to answer.

Octave


oles@ovh.net
16.05.07, 21:44
> Since two weeks i got much connection Problems to my sites and to the
> server. More than 130ms ping and no more than 70KB ftp download!!!


can you give more information about "I" ? I need you IP and IP of
your server in Ovh. I will check all this.


OVH_Kunde
16.05.07, 21:18
Zitat Zitat von bene
But as I told before 1&1 is a huge company. They have millions of customers, they can live with maybe less than 1% users who generate traffic >1TB
But OVH got masses of "geiz ist geil" users who don't want to pay anytihing but expect service like a premier customer and the allowance to pump tons of traffic via the "i have paid for it" connection - instead of using it reasonable...
The =2 offer is too expensive for them - have you ever made a mind why the really cheap prices in germany have been rising during the last time? (OK - now with flat and big servers, but no more 20eur boxes...)
But if you are e.g. linux developer and want to show others your result in form of sourcecode or iso images...what will you do? one image has 400-1000MB!
how will you offer this with "reasonable" traffic?

others develop shareware or freeware (like me) witch is possibly downloaded by tenthousand users (if it is good freeware - why not?)...how will you do this reasonable?

should ovh put a "this root server is for html files only" on their website?
or should i only host html on ovh and my freeware files on 1und1? should i pay 2x? then i can switch directly too

It is the MAIN-TASK of OVH to grow like 1und1 so that they can make a good mixed calculation and can laugh about the 1% that makes too much traffic,too!
and this can not be done if there are unsatisfied customers left alone in an unmoderated forum how it was for a long time...and everybody reads at ovh at google or blogs will get this results and will go directly to another hoster


I gave the german-ovh support my telephone number because i wanted to help them to grow and make a good business here...but no one called me...

bene
16.05.07, 20:02
But as I told before 1&1 is a huge company. They have millions of customers, they can live with maybe less than 1% users who generate traffic >1TB
But OVH got masses of "geiz ist geil" users who don't want to pay anytihing but expect service like a premier customer and the allowance to pump tons of traffic via the "i have paid for it" connection - instead of using it reasonable...
The =2 offer is too expensive for them - have you ever made a mind why the really cheap prices in germany have been rising during the last time? (OK - now with flat and big servers, but no more 20eur boxes...)

sledge0303
16.05.07, 19:59
And these servers are not intended to put an Linux mirror or whatever on it.
For a company like 1&1 (they named theirself as worlds largest webhost) would be one hardcore user not that much, because they've millions of other customers who use their servers for just some few GBs a month..
The fact at OVH was that a huge number of customers were generating tons of bandwith...
It is - without a doubt - the truth...

OVH_Kunde
16.05.07, 19:48
Zitat Zitat von bene
@OVH_Kunde:
I can't belive that you can make such amounts of Traffic at the 1&1 Network - They have _very_ strict usage policies and qouted from their website
You get once a traffic limit (for security against warez hackers), but you can switch back it to 100mbit in the control center

bene
16.05.07, 19:45
@OVH_Kunde:
I can't belive that you can make such amounts of Traffic at the 1&1 Network - They have _very_ strict usage policies and qouted from their website:

Unbegrenztes Trafficvolumen für Ihren 1&1 Server (bei Trafficverbrauch über 1.000 GB/Monat erfolgt zu Ihrer eigenen Sicherheit Anbindung mit 10 MBit/s, Freischaltung auf 100 MBit/s Ihrem Control-Center möglich, keine Mehrkosten für Traffic).
And these servers are not intended to put an Linux mirror or whatever on it.
For a company like 1&1 (they named theirself as worlds largest webhost) would be one hardcore user not that much, because they've millions of other customers who use their servers for just some few GBs a month..
The fact at OVH was that a huge number of customers were generating tons of bandwith...

sledge0303
16.05.07, 19:36
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
I understand it, but I can't. Why ?

Sorry.
No, you havn´t understand me correct.

The question I answered was

anyway I think lot of customers talking about the wrong support
way of work. can you give more examples ?
I replied to this

In the same way I asked for a change in BIOS setup. I received no reply. Ok, in case it isn´t possible, a simple 'no' should be enough but no answer?...
The point was 'no' reply by support - nothing else

My own customers sometimes ask for things what couldn't be realized in the past nor will be done in future. I think it is a question of kindness to answer a polite asked question.

Greetz Thomas

OVH_Kunde
16.05.07, 19:34
1&1 shows that real 100mbit flatrates for 69€/month are possible

a friend is hosting linux images on the server and has 10-20TB traffic/month and nobody says anything against it

so perhaps you will need a backbone in germany for something like this...

Centro
16.05.07, 18:21
Good Evening,

my meaning about this Post is very different.

On one site you say you would offer Server for small website projects only. But you advertise 100MB full connection. How would it work in both sites?

Im one of onehundred tester of "isgenug" Server. The Server is really "kimsufi" for me, the connection was very good until last weeks and the support from Angie Herrmann and Peter was very good.

Since two weeks i got much connection Problems to my sites and to the server. More than 130ms ping and no more than 70KB ftp download!!!

Oh, FTP Download you would think. No i dont use P2P or such other illegal things. I only use a SAMBA Server over VPN to use my files on every place i need it. like an virtual hdd for example.

"Herrmann" got a hole of files to see this problem too.

At december the 16th the server will shutdown or order for a new period.
At the seeing of the moment i dont know what i should do! - Can you say it?

I was very contently with the product but why pay for a server i cant use`?

My Friends and i too are users from 1&1 DSL which uses the connection from T-Online.
Exactly at this provider you have problems. I heard about it weeks ago, but i didnt have such problems. Why didnt i have it but now?

Do you think about building a Servercenter in Germany `? - Own carrier in Germany may repair the connect problem with T-Online.

To inform you i use ca. 800 to 1,2 TB traffic per month so i think if this is to much i have to search for a other hoster! ?

Thank you for having a open ear to the wishes and hopes from your small users they dont use it for commercial things.

Greetz Centro

oles@ovh.net
16.05.07, 17:44
> Pardon, there's a missunderstanding. I never said you should offer
> changes at HW nodes (BIOS). It was just a question for a favour,
> nothing more - nothing less.


I understand it, but I can't. Why ? Because it's question of justice.
We propose the same service for all customers. Small and large. I
can't answer you "Yes, no problem" and answer to an another customer
"Sorry I will not". And I can't answer to all customers "Yes, no
problem" since it's not in our offers. If we propose something it
has to work and for all customers. Right now this option is not
allowed and we will not propose it in the futur. Why ? Because BIOS
is really a central point of stability of the server. I will not
propose you something why don't work. It has to work. So I make all
job for and I can't let you modify BIOS.

Sorry.


sledge0303
16.05.07, 17:15
Hello,

I prepare the kernel every 2-3 months or when there is security
hole. If you want a new kernel, I can see if we can propose it
for you in standard.

Preparing kernel is not easy. We put lot of patchs (not only SATA).
If you are not using our kernels, you can get lot of problems since
our hardware is pretty new. Using our kernel allows you to get a
servers which work. If it doesn't, it's my job to propose you
something which works ...
I understand what you want to say. Every admin is responseable for this what he/she is doing, even an own Kernel installment belongs to this.
Anyway, everything's working fine for me now.

stop. we don't propose it. never before et never in futur. our goal
is to propose you a dedicated server which work. and we do all
necesary job for this. so bios is our job. kernel too.

the solution for you is to get your own server and you have to find
out a housing service. we propose it in france (paris). so not for
you with us but I think you will get lot of solutions in german.
Pardon, there's a missunderstanding. I never said you should offer any changes at HW node (BIOS). It was just a question for a favour, nothing more - nothing less.
And of course, I have an own network but really like to prefer to host some of my projects at OVH servers. That's not the question, the question is how reliable is OVH? Am I reduced in speed because my own customer produce much more traffic as you tolerate? Of course, I won't and can't host at Kimsufi servers, as you can resume by reading these lines.

Yes, I have a test server and use my possibilities to test everything, incl. connection - support - possibility for virtualization - images and whatever you are offering. My results either sent by mail to a responseable person at OVH and/or in a public blog.
For some reasons I am amazed about your company except some small things regarding the linux-images you offer and rescue system. That's another point we can discuss privately by mail. The mail is on the way tonight.

Greetz Thomas

oles@ovh.net
16.05.07, 16:48
> It belongs to my Xen project. May you know original Xen sources are
> working with Kernel 2.6.16.X and it doesn?t work without patching SATA
> driver. I have sent Kernel config file, in knowledge OVH was running
> 2.6.16 Kernel with same HW config, asked this way for the mistake or
> maybe for the patch. You can?t believe how much time I spent for
> searching that patch - without result.
> The short answer from support was, your config has been sent to an
> admin and he'll tell you a solution - if possible of course... waiting
> till today...


I prepare the kernel every 2-3 months or when there is security
hole. If you want a new kernel, I can see if we can propose it
for you in standard.

Preparing kernel is not easy. We put lot of patchs (not only SATA).
If you are not using our kernels, you can get lot of problems since
our hardware is pretty new. Using our kernel allows you to get a
servers which work. If it doesn't, it's my job to propose you
something which works ...

> In the same way I asked for a change in BIOS setup. I received no


stop. we don't propose it. never before et never in futur. our goal
is to propose you a dedicated server which work. and we do all
necesary job for this. so bios is our job. kernel too.

the solution for you is to get your own server and you have to find
out a housing service. we propose it in france (paris). so not for
you with us but I think you will get lot of solutions in german.

>> > how about this:
>> > you have choose 3 bandwidth models:
>> > - 100Mbps with X Gb/mo then X Mbps (same price)
>> > it's great for web sites
>> >

>
> I think this way 'YGWYPF'. An Isgenug server is very small and useable
> for web- and mail projects, what means they doesn't need 3TB+
> Bandswith/mo.
>
> An example for my work with customers:
> My own web projects need expected 1,5-2TB months. My customers know how
> much traffic is possible for them and there is and was no need to
> discuse about. The rule is written in form of 'terms and conditions',
> peoples accept and in case they need more bandswith, a simple question
> - new agreement (maybe temporary change of contract) and both sides are
> lucky with quick solutions.
>
> The other points with offering p2p, streaming... I neither used these
> server and can't out of experiences. My own customers are not allowed
> to install p2p etc... they receive a warning first and second
> violations means 'instant dismissal- without notice or compensation'...
> there was no need yet to do this but peoples know...
> As I mentioned earlier 'BofH'


thanks for this informations !

Octave


sledge0303
16.05.07, 13:13
anyway I think lot of customers talking about the wrong support
way of work. can you give more examples ?
There are two things I asked for without any reply yet:

It belongs to my Xen project. May you know original Xen sources are working with Kernel 2.6.16.X and it doesn´t work without patching SATA driver. I have sent Kernel config file, in knowledge OVH was running 2.6.16 Kernel with same HW config, asked this way for the mistake or maybe for the patch. You can´t believe how much time I spent for searching that patch - without result.
The short answer from support was, your config has been sent to an admin and he'll tell you a solution - if possible of course... waiting till today...

In the same way I asked for a change in BIOS setup. I received no reply. Ok, in case it isn´t possible, a simple 'no' should be enough but no answer?
OK, I won't talk that bad about your support team. Angie wrote most of them are still learning and they can't always serve correct answers for question.
I point I can live with, because problems have been solved by myself, except the question mentioned above or possible HW damages.

> how about this:
> you have choose 3 bandwidth models:
> - 100Mbps with X Gb/mo then X Mbps (same price)
> it's great for web sites
>
I think this way 'YGWYPF'. An Isgenug server is very small and useable for web- and mail projects, what means they doesn't need 3TB+ Bandswith/mo.

An example for my work with customers:
My own web projects need expected 1,5-2TB months. My customers know how much traffic is possible for them and there is and was no need to discuse about. The rule is written in form of 'terms and conditions', peoples accept and in case they need more bandswith, a simple question - new agreement (maybe temporary change of contract) and both sides are lucky with quick solutions.

The other points with offering p2p, streaming... I neither used these server and can't out of experiences. My own customers are not allowed to install p2p etc... they receive a warning first and second violations means 'instant dismissal- without notice or compensation'... there was no need yet to do this but peoples know...
As I mentioned earlier 'BofH'

oles@ovh.net
16.05.07, 12:35
> how should this work?

hmm ... it works in france okey okey german people are different.
let's change the way.

> i don't think that most people only make useless traffic to cost out
> the flatrate...perhaps they think that a new youtube could bring mony
> and so they try it...surely there will be black cheeps doing excessive
> p2p...but this
> ones can get limited without any problems with the regulary
> customers...


the only problem we got (until today) were the "professional" market
which looking for the cheapest offerts in the world to use it in 200%
of possibilty.

99.99% of the others regular customar don't need flat 100Mbps 24 hours
per day.

> and last but not least:
> work on the support, continue asking us what can be done to make OVH
> better, WORK ON EXACT!!!! AGBs (mirroring etc) and make the backbone to
> "deutsche telekom" much better...then OVH Germany will grow like a young
> flower in the spring


I think so. The problem is the time and I will try to make it faster.
But the projet like DT will take at least 3 months (since DT is slow
to change). I will try to find out the solution quicker. not easy.
DT is full in Europe and don't want to upgrade links with all theirs
peers (Teleglobe, Global Crossing, Level3, Opentransit, Sprint, Telia, etc)
So all links are full in the evening ... How to touch DT's customers
without DT and quickly. I will find out ...


oles@ovh.net
16.05.07, 12:28
If someone can give more feeling about this kind of modification
of our offerts ? Thanks in advance !

> how about this:
> you have choose 3 bandwidth models:
> - 100Mbps with X Gb/mo then X Mbps (same price)
> it's great for web sites
>
> - 100Mbps best effort (X mbps between 16h-24h then 100Mbps)
> no Gbps limit (same price)
> it's great for p2p, mirrors
>
> if you want to make 100Mbps 24 hours per day.
> - 100Mbps VIP more expensive (980Euro/mo)
> it's great for streaming


oles@ovh.net
16.05.07, 12:28
> to be silent is good for some reasons but not et all. Peoples become
> unpatient after a long time period of wait for an answer they probably
> never receive.
> In this point peoples start to toss out things in form of rough written
> 'complainings' - IOW: start a way of unnecessary threads to everyone
> else in this forum with result: every effected persons feels in need to
> 'contribute' to this...


hmm ... we decided to finish the project v3 asap. I will push
to do it in the best delay. then we will talk about this tool.

anyway I think lot of customers talking about the wrong support
way of work. can you give more examples ?


dennisda
16.05.07, 09:44
Wenn das mitn Service wieder hochkommt werde ich mir wieder ein Server mieten. Habe ja zurzeit nur nen Webspace Acc :P da ich nicht weiter testen konnte wegend er Arbeit. ach ja shit muss ja gleich zur Spät schicht sodele icke warte mal 3 Monate ab und sehe ich änderung wierd einer kommen.

sledge0303
16.05.07, 07:48
It's not really different, but I really like to do it. To be honest
Ovh begins to work in the right way after 4-5 months since we put
100 servers to test. I can say: it's okey and enought. But I want
to propose you the best offerts I can imagine for you with your help.
It's very interesting job to understand the people.
I think mentality between frechs and germans are different a bit. However, I appreciate your things of thoughs regarding abuse problems of terms and conditions very much. They're almost compatible with mine as well. But reading between your lines in some statements left a taste of suspecion like 'everyone with large amount of traffic is doing illegal here'. It doesn´t matter yet, we learn to meet each others point. Not to forget, we are *definately* not talk about your cheapest 'isgenug - Kimsufi' server package only.

I guest, lot of things not going in the right way in support ...
hmmm ...
IMHO: there is the rub!
to be silent is good for some reasons but not et all. Peoples become unpatient after a long time period of wait for an answer they probably never receive.
In this point peoples start to toss out things in form of rough written 'complainings' - IOW: start a way of unnecessary threads to everyone else in this forum with result: every effected persons feels in need to 'contribute' to this...
Yeap. Cheap server means cheap car. Cheap car is enought for me
You're better than me these days. My car is damaged (ask my wife for its reason...grrr) but fortunately I live in a major city with good public travel...

hmm ... angy ? can you help me to remberer ?
grr ... what did I say and where ??!!! )) ...
You/Angie replied yet to this

we spend lot of time to test hardware and to choose the better hardware
since I prefer to pay more for the hardware and spend less time to repair it.
It a choose. Our choose.
Ahhh, that´s quite interesting to know. Anyway, it´s a question how 'cheap' you can get new hardware, all about 20.000 servers you have it shoudn't be that kind of problem for you.

OVH_Kunde
16.05.07, 00:42
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
> so if you can't pay a 100mbit flat for the customers, why do you offer it?

It works in a different way. Hmm ... let's explain it in a different way:
if you want to get 100Mbps 24 hours per day for 30 euro/mo, you have to
make good adv for Ovh, so we will get lot of new customers that will not
use 100Mbps 24 hours per day. So the others customers pay for you ... In
France it works in this way. We have lot of servers 100Mbps 24 hours per
day but we have more servers that use < 100Mbps. It's "sharing" bandwidth
with very good quality for all customers. In German we get not enought new
customers to let you 100Mbps 24 hours per day. Maybe in 6 months ? I don't
think because the things changes with lot of new sites "youtube-like" ...
so we are changing the offerts too. That is why I'm here

> my IP is 84.139.xx.xx
> download rate actually 10KB/s!! and ping time 300ms ....thats HORRIBLE!


Only to Ovh or it's DT general problem ?
how should this work?
if i would present you some new costumers you would give me a real 100mbit flat? should they underline that they got advertised by me?

i don't think that most people only make useless traffic to cost out the flatrate...perhaps they think that a new youtube could bring mony and so they try it...surely there will be black cheeps doing excessive p2p...but this
ones can get limited without any problems with the regulary customers...

and last but not least:
work on the support, continue asking us what can be done to make OVH better, WORK ON EXACT!!!! AGBs (mirroring etc) and make the backbone to "deutsche telekom" much better...then OVH Germany will grow like a young flower in the spring

PS:
an availability-garantuee of 97% is very bad!
99% is the minimum which serious customers tolerates a potential offtime of nearly 2 weeks / year? even my Duron-Homeserver on a SIS Mainboard has a better uptime...

Fritz
16.05.07, 00:33
Hi Angie, Octave and the whole OVH-Team,
nice to read you here ;-)
It's very good and important to solve all problems and to reduce the todo-list soon. I read this thread and I think, most of the facts are mentioned. We'll see, if talking about will change something ;-) I hope, it's possible to get a quality of being satisfied for OVH and the customers.
regards Fritz

oles@ovh.net
16.05.07, 00:10
> *-Ticketsystem: -*
> at the moment the Germanteam make support with our new interface
> developped for support in Germany. So, the support has interne
> interface for answers and can see the message as thread, but customers
> get the answer as an mail.
> It seems that the customer wanna have an support like our support v2:
> with the answer as ticket in Manager and no as an mail.


thanks angy.

I stopped the dev of support v3 1 month ago. I will talk tomorrow
with dev to finish this projet asap.


oles@ovh.net
16.05.07, 00:02
> i think it's a DT problem ... ping to other networks (Strato, Alice,
> Arcor) are OK .... the big problem is the most customers use the
> *Deutsche Telekom*


okey. let's do better job with DT. give me 1-2 weeks. be back soon for
this subject.


oles@ovh.net
16.05.07, 00:00
> Creating an "unlimited" offer in Germany means you always get some
> people who think this means "as much as i could do to harm the
> provider" instead of "i can use as much as i need at no extra cost" -


100% agree.

> So in my eyes it would be a great solution for all customers to provide
> different bandwith offers like the ones you proposed.
> It should be clearly explained (in a non-technical speech) which offer
> fits which requirements.
> The Hardcore users won't be glad about it - but an 1000GB and then
> shaped offer is what most german dedicated Providers do. And it fits
> the needs of 99% customers who use much less bandwith than what is
> included.


I think so. But I think Ovh is able to propose something new as we
proposed in FR, ES, PL and GB. To be honest I don't want to make
"drag & drop" services or read "Ovh does like most german dedicated
Providers do". The differents are in our heads. Let's dig it.

> My Connection to OVH is via the Arcor Network (AS 3209) ok - sometimes
> its routet via AMSIX instead of FreeIX, but speed and pings always OK.


AS3209 I get thought FreeIX (2x1Gbps), Sfinx (1x10Gbps) or Linx/Amsix/Decix(3x1Gbps)
then thought Global Crossing (1x10Gbps) and Teleglobe (1x1Gbps). I have no problems
with this AS at the moment, but will try to se Sfinx with.

I will take care now about this AS. Do you know which anouther AS is important
for german customers ?

Angie
15.05.07, 23:58
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net

> Yepp, are they members in BofH like myself? Ok, I quit jokeing now.
> Angie mentioned a ticket-system is in your minds and should appear
> somedays. IMHO a ticket systems is necessary like the hardware itself.[/color]

hmm ... angy ? can you help me to remberer ?
grr ... what did I say and where ??!!! )) ...
Yes I can help remember all things asked by customers:


Ticketsystem:
at the moment the Germanteam make support with our new interface developped for support in Germany. So, the support has interne interface for answers and can see the message as thread, but customers get the answer as an mail.
It seems that the customer wanna have an support like our support v2: with the answer as ticket in Manager and no as an mail.


Regards,
Angie

TF_SChw@rZl!cht
15.05.07, 23:55
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
> so if you can't pay a 100mbit flat for the customers, why do you offer it?

It works in a different way. Hmm ... let's explain it in a different way:
if you want to get 100Mbps 24 hours per day for 30 euro/mo, you have to
make good adv for Ovh, so we will get lot of new customers that will not
use 100Mbps 24 hours per day. So the others customers pay for you ... In
France it works in this way. We have lot of servers 100Mbps 24 hours per
day but we have more servers that use < 100Mbps. It's "sharing" bandwidth
with very good quality for all customers. In German we get not enought new
customers to let you 100Mbps 24 hours per day. Maybe in 6 months ? I don't
think because the things changes with lot of new sites "youtube-like" ...
so we are changing the offerts too. That is why I'm here

> my IP is 84.139.xx.xx
> download rate actually 10KB/s!! and ping time 300ms ....thats HORRIBLE!


Only to Ovh or it's DT general problem ?
i think it's a DT problem ... ping to other networks (Strato, Alice, Arcor) are OK .... the big problem is the most customers use the *Deutsche Telekom*

oles@ovh.net
15.05.07, 23:50
> so if you can't pay a 100mbit flat for the customers, why do you offer it?

It works in a different way. Hmm ... let's explain it in a different way:
if you want to get 100Mbps 24 hours per day for 30 euro/mo, you have to
make good adv for Ovh, so we will get lot of new customers that will not
use 100Mbps 24 hours per day. So the others customers pay for you ... In
France it works in this way. We have lot of servers 100Mbps 24 hours per
day but we have more servers that use < 100Mbps. It's "sharing" bandwidth
with very good quality for all customers. In German we get not enought new
customers to let you 100Mbps 24 hours per day. Maybe in 6 months ? I don't
think because the things changes with lot of new sites "youtube-like" ...
so we are changing the offerts too. That is why I'm here

> my IP is 84.139.xx.xx
> download rate actually 10KB/s!! and ping time 300ms ....thats HORRIBLE!


Only to Ovh or it's DT general problem ?


TF_SChw@rZl!cht
15.05.07, 23:48
endlich ... darauf habe ich gewartet ..... der thread liest sich wie ein spannendes Buch .... ich bin mal gespannt

oles@ovh.net
15.05.07, 23:44
> Yes, but french and german market are different. You have to explore
> what the customers want, you obviously are going this way since your
> company has started to offer here. Learning is a hard job, as you
> know.


It's not really different, but I really like to do it. To be honest
Ovh begins to work in the right way after 4-5 months since we put
100 servers to test. I can say: it's okey and enought. But I want
to propose you the best offerts I can imagine for you with your help.
It's very interesting job to understand the people.

> Especially in this point I really don?t understand german support team.
> To times a progress of lerning your peoples are not present here. OK,
> many of these complaints are not very easy to take for some
> individuals. But talking to each other helps to move away
> missunderstandings and teachs both sides, customers and support at
> once, to respect each other.


I guest, lot of things not going in the right way in support ...
hmmm ...

> You as a boss just drive a *lousy* BMW??? ... lol...
> I understand what you want saying... no comment in public


Yeap. Cheap server means cheap car. Cheap car is enought for me

> Yepp, are they members in BofH like myself? Ok, I quit jokeing now.
> Angie mentioned a ticket-system is in your minds and should appear
> somedays. IMHO a ticket systems is necessary like the hardware itself.


hmm ... angy ? can you help me to remberer ?
grr ... what did I say and where ??!!! )) ...

> hmmm, sounds like 'get a new server before an *expensive* technician
> take hands on it'


we spend lot of time to test hardware and to choose the better hardware
since I prefer to pay more for the hardware and spend less time to repair it.
It a choose. Our choose.

> It seems you are okay. Many thanks for this quick conversation and
> you?ll receive mail tomorrow or on Thursday if I feel better of course
>


thanks


mic
15.05.07, 23:35
Das ist der Service den wir Anfang des Jahres kennen gelernt hatten. Ein sehr informativer Thread.

mic

Angie
15.05.07, 23:31
Hallo,

sollte jemand der englischen Sprache nicht mächtig sein, hier die Übersetzung des ersten Threads von Octave:

Hallo,

mein Name ist Octave (alias Oles). Ich arbeite für OVH Frankreich/Deutschland/Spanien.
Ich habe Fragen in Bezug auf euere (ihr die Kunden) Meinungen/Fragen im Bereich der Rootserver die wir in Deutschland anbieten.
Ich möchte über alle Eindrücke/Fragen reden und ich will versuchen euch Antworten und Änderungen anzubieten im Bereich Webseite/Angebote, weil wir ernsthaft mit der Arbeit am deutschen Markt anfangen möchten.
Unser Team (Anne,Peter,Angy, und die anderen) haben mir Informationen zukommen lassen, aber ich will lieber direkt mit den Kunden sprechen damit ich sie auch verstehen kann.

Meine Fragen sind sehr einfach (für euch), aber hard für mich:
Was müssen wir an unseren Angeboten ändern?
Was versteht ihr nicht?
Was ist gut?
Was ist nicht gut?

Danke für eure Hilfe.

PS: Bitte entschuldigt, ich spreche kein Deutsch, aber ich habe schon einige Zeit lang Bier in Deutschland getrunken. Ich weis nicht ob es genügt um alles zu verstehen was falsch ist und geändert werden muss, aber ich werde mein Besten tun. Danke.

Solltet ihr privat mit mir reden möchten, sendet mir eine Email an oles@ovh.net

Freundliche Grüsse,
Octave



Ich bin euch gerne bei Übersetzungen Deutsch / Französich und Englisch behilflich.

Gruss,
Angie

lkuderer
15.05.07, 23:00
Das ja mal klasse das sich einer meldet und versucht stellung zu nehmen.

Soweit ich es aber sehe wurde die frage betr.Traffic noch nicht geklärt.
Und die AGB naja ist nicht wirklich hilfreich.

Wenn nur mein english besser wäre hehe

gruß

bene
15.05.07, 22:56
Hi Octave,

i'm one of the first OVH DE Customers...
So I can understand the Problems on both sides.
Creating an "unlimited" offer in Germany means you always get some people who think this means "as much as i could do to harm the provider" instead of "i can use as much as i need at no extra cost" - There is no difference if you offer free traffic, all-you-can-eat-buffet or whatelse.

So in my eyes it would be a great solution for all customers to provide different bandwith offers like the ones you proposed.
It should be clearly explained (in a non-technical speech) which offer fits which requirements.
The Hardcore users won't be glad about it - but an 1000GB and then shaped offer is what most german dedicated Providers do. And it fits the needs of 99% customers who use much less bandwith than what is included.
And if it becomes more, the server will be still on at no extra cost for the customer (for example: funny video on private page shown on tv)

The Service problems mentioned by the other users can't I verfiy by myself since i havn't used support a lot - but i heard it also besides the forum....

My Connection to OVH is via the Arcor Network (AS 3209) ok - sometimes its routet via AMSIX instead of FreeIX, but speed and pings always OK.

sledge0303
15.05.07, 22:44
Zitat Zitat von dennisda
Kann mir mal bitte jemand kurz sagen um was es in diesem TReahd geht ?
Hier geht es um eine Diskussion wo die Chefetage von OVH sich erkundigt was dem Kunden unter den Fingernägeln brennt - grob dargestellt.
Ich werte es als positives Signal um die Situation zwischen OVH und unzufriedenen Kunden zu entspannen. Hoffe nur, der deutsche Support nutzt diese 'Chance' ebenfalls und einige der Gerüchte sowie die Notwendigkeit der öffentlichen 'Beschwerde' findet endlich ein Ende.

PS:
Wer einen Server administrieren will sollte schon etwas Sprachkenntnis mitbringen.

Magicxs
15.05.07, 22:36
also nen bissle english muss man doch können -.-

dennisda
15.05.07, 22:16
Kann mir mal bitte jemand kurz sagen um was es in diesem TReahd geht ?

sledge0303
15.05.07, 21:37
please give me the IP (from, to) or traceroute.
I have your addy and mail you in case it occurred again.

non. but in france, since we are number one, we made the market
so we made the rules. in german, I try to understand how the
market is, to propose something new.
Yes, but french and german market are different. You have to explore what the customers want, you obviously are going this way since your company has started to offer here. Learning is a hard job, as you know.
Especially in this point I really don´t understand german support team. To times a progress of lerning your peoples are not present here. OK, many of these complaints are not very easy to take for some individuals. But talking to each other helps to move away missunderstandings and teachs both sides, customers and support at once, to respect each other.

if the customer is looking for something that make money only for him-self,
it will be change to an another ISP until he will understand that the
relationship has to be win-win. After this the only question is: what
an ISP means "win" for him-self. I like to ride a BMW and eat sushi
every evening, but no more
You as a boss just drive a *lousy* BMW??? ... lol...


it's quite a difficult question. we have about 20'000 dedicated servers,
we have technical staff 24 hours per day in our datancenters. but they
are not as friendly people as our german team is
Yepp, are they members in BofH like myself? Ok, I quit jokeing now.
Angie mentioned a ticket-system is in your minds and should be available somedays. IMHO a ticket systems is necessary like the hardware itself.

a humain costs lot of money. it costs less money to pay a second server ...
hmmm, sounds like 'get a new server before an *expensive* technician take hands on it'
It seems you are okay. Many thanks for this quick conversation and you´ll receive mail tomorrow or on Thursday if I feel better of course

OVH_Kunde
15.05.07, 21:34
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
if the customer is looking for something that make money only for him-self,
it will be change to an another ISP until he will understand that the
relationship has to be win-win. After this the only question is: what
an ISP means "win" for him-self. I like to ride a BMW and eat sushi
every evening, but no more
so if you can't pay a 100mbit flat for the customers, why do you offer it?

I think lot of customers, like in France, don't
want to take care about bandwidth, Gb/mo
So actually with this pseudo fake flatrate people have to care MORE than in any other situation because they never know when they get limited!
a situation of arbitrariness/capriciousness and unclear rules is more bad than every volume rate coud be!

so if you would limit me and i seriously loose mony even if i don't make anything against the AGB i would go to directly to an lawyer
you can't offer 100mbit and limit then to 5 without a good reason only why you don't like people making much traffic! THAT IS NOT LEGAL!!!!
so i'm not unfriendly, but thats the german market: you MUST hold and offer that what you promise!

in germany it is so: if you can't pay your sushi and your BMW while there is written " 100mbit flatrate" on the homepage, you take your html editor and change it to "100mbit volume rate" or anything else.... easy or?

so if you want understand the german market and a support person for the forum and anything else in germany (and actually it's not only the forum that runs bad) then give me a job at OVH, give me the needed powers and you will see how easy it can be! thats no joke (you can get it if you really want!)

----------

my IP is 84.139.xx.xx
download rate actually 10KB/s!! and ping time 300ms ....thats HORRIBLE!

PS:
i know my writing style is a bit sharply and direct, but i think thats the only way to show up the facts!
So don't understand it wrong, i'm happy you are here and learning!

oles@ovh.net
15.05.07, 21:02
sledge0303 a écrit:
>
>> which AS ?

>
> Pardon, I don?t understand what you mean with 'which AS'...
>


please give me the IP (from, to) or traceroute.

> You can?t tell me it is just a prob caused by germans only.


non. but in france, since we are number one, we made the market
so we made the rules. in german, I try to understand how the
market is, to propose something new.

>> I don't like "moderated forums". I believe the free talk is the
>> better for a firm like ovh: the firm that want to be better.

>
> I for one think and feel the same way. May it runs better in case you
> and your german team will be more active in forum. There?s nothing
> what we can?t discuse about...


yeap.

>
> Anyway, OVH-Kunde picks up some important things:
>
>> The German support told me that they don't know what "mirroring" in the
>> AGB should be exactly and that the word "mirroring" is a trick to ban
>> people with too much LEGAL traffic!!

>
> This makes sense to me. Sense in this form, there are different views
> of things between you in France and Support in Germany. What I always
> thought yet.
>
>> some others develop linux distrubutions BY THEMSELF and ONLY host it on
>> ovh...so NO MIRROR...but they get limited in bandwith....

>
> What I meant with a well known formerly customer of OVH who received
> bandwith limits in the past till he changed to another ISP.


if the customer is looking for something that make money only for him-self,
it will be change to an another ISP until he will understand that the
relationship has to be win-win. After this the only question is: what
an ISP means "win" for him-self. I like to ride a BMW and eat sushi
every evening, but no more

> A mainly discussed and asked for option: customers should be able to
> talk to an admin at the data center where his/her server is located.
> That makes sense for me if your company offers something like a
> ticket-system. A copy of this mail will receive Support and the other
> one an admin at datacenter.


it's quite a difficult question. we have about 20'000 dedicated servers,
we have technical staff 24 hours per day in our datancenters. but they
are not as friendly people as our german team is

> Expecially at weekend and at public hollidays a wonderful option, am I
> right?


a humain costs lot of money. it costs less money to pay a second server ...


sledge0303
15.05.07, 20:33
right now is it correct ? if not, please drop me an email.
DT is quite difficult to take in peering (you have to eat and
drink with vice-CEO of DT to make big money then maybe you can
get it ...), but I have some solution if we have the difficulty.
You have seen that thread where peoples reported about low speed to OVH servers with Deutsche Telekom. It should be a quick and *cheap* solution for.

> I am connected to Internet by 'Hansenet' so called 'Alice-DSL', except
> some days connect is and was always ok. OK, Angie said you all are
> still trying to solve that prob.

which AS ?
Pardon, I don´t understand what you mean with 'which AS'...

"illegal trafic" for me (the AGB says it) is p2p, mirroring,
youtube-like services, etc

Our network is not here for "high download services". We propose really
cheap servers with good quality of bandwidth, but if for "high download
services" the network has to be different, more expensive. So the offers
should be more expensive. I think lot of customers, like in France, don't
want to take care about bandwidth, Gb/mo. That is why they look for
"no limit" even if they don't need it. It's our french market. Is german
market the same or we have to put "hard limit Gb/mo" ?
I really respect your intention to do a flat for all customers. Wherever you offer a good thing, the way of being missused is possible on the same way.
You can´t tell me abuse against AGB effects german customers only.

I plan to learn german, but please give 1 year lol
I will talk with our team ...
German language is really hard to learn...

I don't like "moderated forums". I believe the free talk is the
better for a firm like ovh: the firm that want to be better.
I for one think and feel the same way. May it runs better in case you and your german team will be more active in forum. There´s nothing what we can´t discuse about...

Anyway, OVH-Kunde picks up some important things:

The German support told me that they don't know what "mirroring" in the AGB should be exactly and that the word "mirroring" is a trick to ban people with too much LEGAL traffic!!
This makes sense to me. Sense in this form, there are different views of things between you in France and Support in Germany. What I always thought yet.

some others develop linux distrubutions BY THEMSELF and ONLY host it on ovh...so NO MIRROR...but they get limited in bandwith....
What I meant with a well known formerly customer of OVH who received bandwith limits in the past for legal occurred traffic till he changed to another ISP.

Another thing is a potential problem at the weekend...a slow coming hardware defect which appears overs hours and is not affected by live monitoring ...there is no way to contact support at the weekend...this is catastrophal too!!
A mainly discussed and asked for option: customers should be able to talk to an admin at the data center where his/her server is located.
That makes sense for me if your company offers something like a ticket-system. A copy of this ticket will receive Support and the other one an admin at datacenter.
Expecially at weekend and at public hollidays a wonderful option, am I right?

Greetz Thomas

oles@ovh.net
15.05.07, 20:32
OVH_Kunde a écrit:
> sorry, but this is no argument...The Problem is not p2p, nobody has a
> problem banning or limit this poeple
> BUT: The German support told me that they don't know what "mirroring"
> in the AGB should be exactly and that * the word "mirroring" is a trick
> to ban people with too much LEGAL traffic!!*
> And why? Because Mirroring can be everything...It can be the 20MB
> download on my shareware-page which is loaded by thousands of
> people...it's only hosted on MY server...but ovh then will say: hey
> thats a binary...thats a mirror!! (but why a 100mbit traffic flat for
> only 3KB html pages?? is every binary a mirror? at which size??)
> some others develop linux distrubutions BY THEMSELF and ONLY host it on
> ovh...so NO MIRROR...but they get limited in bandwith....
> And some others only host bigger html pages with much pictures and they
> get reduced too!
>
> and this is very very sad and the german support agrees to my
> arguments!!
> It's a catastrophy and it's "arbitraire" (france)!
> if you can't price a traffic flat you must make volume tarifes or exact
> definitions when people get limited to 5mbit


how about this:
you have choose 3 bandwidth models:
- 100Mbps with X Gb/mo then X Mbps (same price)
it's great for web sites

- 100Mbps best effort (X mbps between 16h-24h then 100Mbps)
no Gbps limit (same price)
it's great for p2p, mirrors

if you want to make 100Mbps 24 hours per day.
- 100Mbps VIP more expensive (980Euro/mo)
it's great for streaming


> Another thing is a potential problem at the weekend...a slow coming
> hardware defect which appears overs hours and is not affected by live
> monitoring ...there is no way to contact support at the weekend...this
> is catastrophal too!!
> And then after 30h downtime? you get 2,5% remuneration...it's only
> fun..


what is your server's name ?

> Then you must work on the bandwith to "german telekom"...it's europes
> biggest provider and 20KB/s download is fun too...


do you have it right now ? what is you IP (from, to) or traceroute ?

Octave

--
Pour avoir une aide rapide et efficace, la méthode est simple:
- indiquez les informations techniques sur l'offre que vous avez
- le nom du serveur ou/et
- le type d'hébergement mutualisé ou/et
- le nom de domaine ou/et
- le nom de la base SQL ou/et
- etc mais que des informations technique (jamais de mot de passe !)
- décrivez en 1-3 lignes votre problème

PS. je ne suis pas de support d'Ovh. je viens de mon temps libre
aider ceux qui ont des problèmes et me permettent de les aider
c'est à dire qui ont fournit les informations techniques sur
l'offre qu'ils ont et qui ont fait une rapide description du
problème.


OVH_Kunde
15.05.07, 20:02
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
In france, we propose 100Mbps illimited with no limit. We are trying
to propose something in this way but the german people try to not
respect the AGB (p2p, mirrors, streaming, etc). So I try to imagine
something that would work for us and for german customers. I have
some ideas but I would like to talk with the german customers before.
Hello....

sorry, but this is no argument...The Problem is not p2p, nobody has a problem banning or limit this poeple
BUT: The German support told me that they don't know what "mirroring" in the AGB should be exactly and that the word "mirroring" is a trick to ban people with too much LEGAL traffic!!
And why? Because Mirroring can be everything...It can be the 20MB download on my shareware-page which is loaded by thousands of people...it's only hosted on MY server...but ovh then will say: hey thats a binary...thats a mirror!! (but why a 100mbit traffic flat for only 3KB html pages?? is every binary a mirror? at which size??)
some others develop linux distrubutions BY THEMSELF and ONLY host it on ovh...so NO MIRROR...but they get limited in bandwith....
And some others only host bigger html pages with much pictures and they get reduced too!

and this is very very sad and the german support agrees to my arguments!!
It's a catastrophy and it's "arbitraire" (france)!
if you can't price a traffic flat you must make volume tarifes or exact definitions when people get limited to 5mbit


Another thing is a potential problem at the weekend...a slow coming hardware defect which appears overs hours and is not affected by live monitoring ...there is no way to contact support at the weekend...this is catastrophal too!!
And then after 30h downtime? you get 2,5% remuneration...it's only fun..

Then you must work on the bandwith to "german telekom"...it's europes biggest provider and 20KB/s download is fun too...

oles@ovh.net
15.05.07, 19:56
sledge0303 a écrit:
> Without a question, your price is ok. Connect to your servers,
> especially for T-Com customers here in Germany, obviously so ola ola in
> the afternoon.


right now is it correct ? if not, please drop me an email.
DT is quite difficult to take in peering (you have to eat and
drink with vice-CEO of DT to make big money then maybe you can
get it ...), but I have some solution if we have the difficulty.

> I am connected to Internet by 'Hansenet' so called 'Alice-DSL', except
> some days connect is and was always ok. OK, Angie said you all are
> still trying to solve that prob.


which AS ?

> Regarding illegal traffic. I have seen the server of one formerly
> customer whit legal 'high traffic'. His company was offering
> 'evaluations' software with own copyright, what means his boss was
> owner of copyright.
> He got blocked by you down to 10Mbit (not 5) and no one at OVH won?t be
> responseable for this action. It seems to me everybody with large
> traffic may be suspect for shareing illegal software/service -
> however.


"illegal trafic" for me (the AGB says it) is p2p, mirroring,
youtube-like services, etc

Our network is not here for "high download services". We propose really
cheap servers with good quality of bandwidth, but if for "high download
services" the network has to be different, more expensive. So the offers
should be more expensive. I think lot of customers, like in France, don't
want to take care about bandwidth, Gb/mo. That is why they look for
"no limit" even if they don't need it. It's our french market. Is german
market the same or we have to put "hard limit Gb/mo" ?

> Sounds like good
> You should be supported by someone who can read and understand german
> language. It isn?t a small amount of customers who are unable to read
> conversations in english. The main conversation (between both of us for
> example) can stay here in this thread but for other should be a thread
> in german.
> Admins and no knowledge in english, it doesn?t match... but it is
> another point we could become offtopic in this thread.


I plan to learn german, but please give 1 year lol
I will talk with our team ...

> I?ll make a list and either post it here or sent it by mail to you.
> Some of the points a mentioned in thread above.


great.

>> > - moderation (no censorship!!) for this forum

>>
>> what do you propose ?

>
> A really hard point how to find out the best way to manage this.
> Maybe you change the face of this board completely.
>
> a) smalltalk
> b) complaints and question
> c) test customers
> d) tipps+tricks for customers (howtos)
> e) questions by future customers (billing, prices etc pp.)


hmmm ...

> Moderators should close threads immediately in case a rumour starts to
> make the round and the 'complaining message' contains no proofs,
> evidences for what he/she want complain for.
> and of course, message in form of flames or appearing written by a
> troll without any sense and brain.


I don't like "moderated forums". I believe the free talk is the
better for a firm like ovh: the firm that want to be better.


sledge0303
15.05.07, 19:20
Hello,

In france, we propose 100Mbps illimited with no limit. We are trying
to propose something in this way but the german people try to not
respect the AGB (p2p, mirrors, streaming, etc). So I try to imagine
something that would work for us and for german customers. I have
some ideas but I would like to talk with the german customers before.
OK, 'peoples try to not respect...' is a valid arguement for eleminating illegal traffic. You could stop those peoples with correct settings in your routers/switch like I do. Ports for p2p, emule and whatever excists are blocked this way. OK, ports can be changed but these services are always sending not a unique header in every request. That could be blocked as well.
A simple trick, IMHO
Anyway, my support for OVH is for sure in case someone *really* violate AGB. This isn´t the question!

Yes. You are talking with the "killers of illegal traffic" lol
It's my job to check it in Ovh (I manage Ovh's 10gig network ).
Some customers make illegal trafic (p2p in different way, ftp,
nntp, emule, etc) and I limit then to 5Mbps. I should cut them
since they don't respect AGB, but I don't want to do it since
that paid. So they have 5Mbps until the end of terms.

In other way: you will be able to make 100Mbps 24 hours per day,
31 days per months using p2p, nntp, emule etc for this price.
Without a question, your price is ok. Connect to your servers, especially for T-Com customers here in Germany, obviously so ola ola in the afternoon.
I am connected to Internet by 'Hansenet' so called 'Alice-DSL', except some days connect is and was always ok. OK, Angie said you all are still trying to solve that prob.
Regarding illegal traffic. I have seen the server of one formerly customer whit legal 'high traffic'. His company was offering 'evaluations' software with own copyright, what means his boss was owner of copyright.
He got blocked by you down to 10Mbit (not 5) and no one at OVH won´t be responseable for this action. It seems to me everybody with large traffic may be suspect for shareing illegal software/service - however.

> The only answer peoples receive by phone is simply, we have no
> information what happened to your server in France.
> Sounds like there?s a problem in communication between OVH-FR and
> OVH-GER.
> Anyway, communication between Support and customer should become
> better. That?s what suck at OVH these days.

That is why I'm here
Sounds like good
You should be supported by someone who can read and understand german language. It isn´t a small amount of customers who are unable to read conversations in english. The main conversation (between both of us for example) can stay here in this thread but for other should be a thread in german.
Admins and no knowledge in english, it doesn´t match... but it is another point we could become offtopic in this thread.

I hope, it will change. If there is a risk of dead, drop me an email
to oles@ovh.net
Your addy is saved in my lists. will post you an e-mail later from my offical addy.

> - attention for wishes and recommendations by (test) customers

let's talk about.
I´ll make a list and either post it here or sent it by mail to you. Some of the points a mentioned in thread above.

> - moderation (no censorship!!) for this forum

what do you propose ?
A really hard point how to find out the best way to manage this.
Maybe you change the face of this board completely.

a) smalltalk
b) complaints and question
c) test customers
d) tipps+tricks for customers (howtos)
e) questions by future customers (billing, prices etc pp.)

Moderators should close threads immediately in case a rumour starts to make the round and the 'complaining message' contains no proofs, evidences for what he/she want complain for.
and of course, message in form of flames or appearing written by a troll without any sense and brain.


Greetz Thomas

oles@ovh.net
15.05.07, 18:44
Hi,

sledge0303 a écrit:
> Your offers regarding dedicated servers are great on the first look.
> The first question should be: what kind of traffic is considered as too
> much?


In france, we propose 100Mbps illimited with no limit. We are trying
to propose something in this way but the german people try to not
respect the AGB (p2p, mirrors, streaming, etc). So I try to imagine
something that would work for us and for german customers. I have
some ideas but I would like to talk with the german customers before.

> It should be a clear and for every customer understandable statement.
> I have asked German Support several times in hope to get an answer what
> peoples makes sure either is OVH the real McCoy or not in his/her need.
> The other thing is, many customers have reported about sudden traffic
> limits down up to 10Mbit/sec without receiving any informations about.
> I believe there must be something wrong in communication between
> OVH-France and OVH Germany.


Yes. You are talking with the "killers of illegal traffic" lol
It's my job to check it in Ovh (I manage Ovh's 10gig network ).
Some customers make illegal trafic (p2p in different way, ftp,
nntp, emule, etc) and I limit then to 5Mbps. I should cut them
since they don't respect AGB, but I don't want to do it since
that paid. So they have 5Mbps until the end of terms.

In other way: you will be able to make 100Mbps 24 hours per day,
31 days per months using p2p, nntp, emule etc for this price.

> The only answer peoples receive by phone is simply, we have no
> information what happened to your server in France.
> Sounds like there?s a problem in communication between OVH-FR and
> OVH-GER.
> Anyway, communication between Support and customer should become
> better. That?s what suck at OVH these days.


That is why I'm here

> Back to TOS for German customers. Most of them definately violate
> German laws. I recommend a lawyer should read every line first before
> making it accessable for public.
>
> What I want say is, OVH isn?t that bad what many peoples toss out here
> in forum. All complains still as result of silence between customers
> and support team.
>
> Once again, here are the points what OVH should make better in future
>
> - communication support/customer


I hope, it will change. If there is a risk of dead, drop me an email
to oles@ovh.net

> - attention for wishes and recommendations by (test) customers


let's talk about.

> - moderation (no censorship!!) for this forum


what do you propose ?

Octave

sledge0303
15.05.07, 17:39
Zitat Zitat von oles@ovh.net
Hi,
My name is Octave (alias Oles). I work for Ovh France/German/Spain.
I have some questions about the feeling/the questions you (the customers)
have about the dedicated servers that we propose in German.
I would like that we talk about all the fears/the questions you have,
and I will try to give your the answers/modify our site/modify our
offers, since we want to start the real work on German market soon
with the best offert. Our staff (Anne, Peter, Angy and the others)
gave me some informations, but I like to talk with the real customers
and try to understand them

My questions are very easy (for you), but very hard for me: what have
we change/modify in our offerts ? what you don't understard ? what
is wrong ? what is good ?

Thanks for you help.

PS. Sorry I don't speek german, but I spent lot of time drinking
the bear in German I don't know if it's enought to understand
what is still wrong and has to be modified, but I will try to do
my best. Thanks !

If you want to talk with me in private way, please drop me an email
to oles@ovh.net

Regards,
Octave
Hello,

nice to meet you here in German OVH Forum.

Your offers regarding dedicated servers are great on the first look. The first question should be: what kind of traffic is considered as too much?
It should be a clear and for every customer understandable statement.
I have asked German Support several times in hope to get an answer what peoples makes sure either is OVH the real McCoy or not in his/her need.
The other thing is, many customers have reported about sudden traffic limits down up to 10Mbit/sec without receiving any informations about its reasons. I believe there must be something wrong in communication between OVH-France and OVH Germany.
The only answer peoples receive by phone is simply, we have no information what happened to your server in France.
Sounds like there´s a problem in communication between OVH-FR and OVH-GER.
Anyway, communication between Support and customer should become better. That´s what suck at OVH these days only. Nothing more, nothing less... ok the images are another point we could start a discussion about
(Kernel, Bootloader are different to *official* Debian releases)...

Back to your terms and conditions for German customers. Most of them definately violate German laws. I recommend a lawyer should read every line first before making it accessable for public.

What I want say is, OVH isn´t that bad what many peoples toss out here in forum. All complains still as result of silence between customers and support team.
You have a charmant german speaking Lady (Angie) in your company, she could manage everything here in forum and she should be able to kill every rumour before it makes the round in scene!
Peter and Mathias are the same, both should support Angie as well before rumours are making the round though.
But all appear once in a months only...
Please do not listen the voice of peoples who complain without any contribution (incl. 'peoples' who are whining for shuting down this forum as well) for this community.


Once again, here are the points what OVH should make better in future

  1. communication support/customer
  2. attention for wishes and recommendations by (test) customers
  3. moderation (no censorship!!) for this forum


Many thanks for your attention by reading these lines. Sorry my concentration is bad today as cause of being sick like a dog (flu) and my family got hit harder like myself
What is good with OVH?
Your customer interface (GUI) for example, except some mistakes as cause of wrong translation from french to german: excelent work!
Possibility to get a server without minimum time for contract, what makes sure everybody can test OVH first
There are much more points I tell you later, see reason above...

If you have any questions, feel free and ask me either by mail or here in forum

sledge0303_AT_hotmail_DOT_com

Regards
Thomas

oles@ovh.net
15.05.07, 16:32
Hi,
My name is Octave (alias Oles). I work for Ovh France/German/Spain.
I have some questions about the feeling/the questions you (the customers)
have about the dedicated servers that we propose in German.
I would like that we talk about all the fears/the questions you have,
and I will try to give your the answers/modify our site/modify our
offers, since we want to start the real work on German market soon
with the best offert. Our staff (Anne, Peter, Angy and the others)
gave me some informations, but I like to talk with the real customers
and try to understand them

My questions are very easy (for you), but very hard for me: what have
we change/modify in our offerts ? what you don't understard ? what
is wrong ? what is good ?

Thanks for you help.

PS. Sorry I don't speek german, but I spent lot of time drinking
the bear in German I don't know if it's enought to understand
what is still wrong and has to be modified, but I will try to do
my best. Thanks !

If you want to talk with me in private way, please drop me an email
to oles@ovh.net

Regards,
Octave